Live data from Hacker News

How journalists use youtube-dl

freedom.press

31–40 of 348 posts

Re: How journalists use youtube-dl

#31
post #23
post #20

There's a fork of youtube-dl seems to be pretty active: https://github.com/blackjack4494/yt-dlc

I did not look at the repo — but has anyone checked if this is trustworthy? Probably many are looking for a new source - providing a nice and convenient entry point to seed dubious / dangerous additions (aka. malware).

From Readme "youtube-dlc is a fork of youtube-dl with the intention of getting features tested by the community merged in the tool faster, since youtube-dl's development seems to be slowing down. (https://github.com/ytdl-org/youtube-dl/issues/26462)"

Re: How journalists use youtube-dl

#32
Microsoft has to reverse this takedown. Even though it is called "youtube-dl", it also is for downloading videoes on hundres of other video platforms! Many, as stated in this article, use it for research purposes and investigative journalism.

Why do companies like MS, Google, Amazon etc acquire smaller companies if they cant protect the values these small companies stand for and made them attractive in first place.

Re: How journalists use youtube-dl

#33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The “you can see it but you must watch and ad” model... ... funds OTA television. Also funds YT. With OTA, it is okay to record OTA broadcasts using a VCR, so I'm not sure why youtube-dl would be different.

The different, Google would argue, is that YouTube-dl doesn't download the ads, while a VCR captures ads and content alike. But really, if the VCR were invented today, it would be made illegal.

It's not like they didn't try their damnedest to make the VCR illegal when it was invented.

Re: How journalists use youtube-dl

#34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The “you can see it but you must watch and ad” model... ... funds OTA television. Also funds YT. With OTA, it is okay to record OTA broadcasts using a VCR, so I'm not sure why youtube-dl would be different.

The different, Google would argue, is that YouTube-dl doesn't download the ads, while a VCR captures ads and content alike. But really, if the VCR were invented today, it would be made illegal.

Not like they didn’t try to make it illegal originally.

“I say to you that the VCR is to the American film producer and the American public as the Boston strangler is to the woman home alone.“ - Jack Valenti, former MPAA president, in 1982, explaining to Congress why the VCR should be illegal

Re: How journalists use youtube-dl

#35
When my full-time job was as a journalist, I used youtube-dl all the time as a way to have archives of content that was either in danger of being taken down (related to a mass-shooting or other global event) or that the creator would take down after it received attention. In fact, I used to have instructions for how to install it in the various wikis/docs for other team members (this was easier once the Python GUI frontend became available, but I still created step-by-step instructions for specific settings).

I produce/host a few weekly news shows focused on developer-centric news and updates and have a keyboard macro setup to run youtube-dl against a text file with URLs not to download the videos, but the thumbnails for videos, so I can use them in the on-screen graphics when talking about a specific story. Before I scripted that solution, the process of having to manually extract the thumbnail for any video I was highlighting was a major PITA.

Also, being frank, youtube-dl is significantly better than the official YouTube API for downloading past content from channels I own/manage. It’s faster and a lot more scriptable. I have automated scripts set to watch specific playlists or channels and auto-download stuff for archival purposes — and again, this is content that I either own or that exists on a channel where I’m one of the admins.

It’s unfortunate that the test suite had links to commercial music — we’ve seen in past RIAA litigation that that is enough to go against the argument that this isn’t encouraging download of copyrighted content.

But as a tool, for not just YouTube but so many other services, it’s invaluable even in non-data hoarding/grey area or straight up infringement scenarios.

To be clear, I’ve often used youtube-dl to infringe (as have the vast majority of its users), but that’s my choice/fault. The tool itself has plenty of non-infringing uses. I just wish they’d either linked the test file to another area or used other examples.

Re: How journalists use youtube-dl

#36

Youtube-dl had some good notes in their README about legitimate uses and an explanation about how they tried to avoid adding sites that specialized in infringing content, but they really did themselves a legal disservice by explicitly using copyrighted music video content as tests. That will not help their argument at all. Youtube-dl absolutely has important and completely legal uses, reporting being among them, but…

> did themselves a legal disservice by explicitly using copyrighted music video content as tests.

They had no alternative other than not having tests for that particular functionality. The tests were testing youtube-partner specific functionality: the procedure needed to download content from some youtube partners is different.

Moreover, the tests just throw away the downloaded material... it would be entirely reasonable for a court to conclude that there is no copyright interest involved in that activity at all and would be extraordinarily unlikely that any court would find it to be anything but fair use if they did conclude a copyright was involved at all.

If it hadn't been the test cases the RIAA probably would have dug up some old forum post advocating infringement by some occasional contributor. They were always going to argue something.

Re: How journalists use youtube-dl

#37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The “you can see it but you must watch and ad” model... ... funds OTA television. Also funds YT. With OTA, it is okay to record OTA broadcasts using a VCR, so I'm not sure why youtube-dl would be different.

The different, Google would argue, is that YouTube-dl doesn't download the ads, while a VCR captures ads and content alike. But really, if the VCR were invented today, it would be made illegal.

You can easily splice out the ads from DVRs/VCRs.

Re: How journalists use youtube-dl

#38

Imo... people should be able to download stuff for free if they’re able to see it for free. The “you can see it but you must watch an ad” model is weird and leads to unenforceable/wacky situations like this (I’m not really a stakeholder tho so who cares what I think)

> The “you can see it but you must watch and ad” model... ... funds OTA television. Also funds YT. With OTA, it is okay to record OTA broadcasts using a VCR, so I'm not sure why youtube-dl would be different.

DMCA section 1201 is not about copyright infringement. It’s there to make things that are not copyright infringement illegal.

This is how John Deere got away with prohibiting farmers from repairing their tractors, etc. This is why time-shifting and format-shifting were just fine for OTA/cable television/CDs/etc but are practically nonexistent today.

Re: How journalists use youtube-dl

#39

Imo... people should be able to download stuff for free if they’re able to see it for free. The “you can see it but you must watch an ad” model is weird and leads to unenforceable/wacky situations like this (I’m not really a stakeholder tho so who cares what I think)

> The “you can see it but you must watch and ad” model... ... funds OTA television. Also funds YT. With OTA, it is okay to record OTA broadcasts using a VCR, so I'm not sure why youtube-dl would be different.

I never thought of the VCR comparison before and it's interesting. Is recording a video delivered over IP different than recording a video delivered OTA or via cable (which is probably IP these days)?

Re: How journalists use youtube-dl

#40

[Post deleted after 60 minutes. It has had adequate exposure.]

> that Microsoft/Github pulled youtube-dl offline by choosing to respond to a DMCA takedown order that is not procedurally valid.... The fact that Microsoft didn't tell the RIAA to go Disney themselves means that 100% of the blame lies at Microsoft's feet. No exceptions.

What you said is clearly correct, but I don't think it's reasonable to expect any company to insert themselves in the middle of these disputes. At scale it's impossible.

Imagine you run a forum with millions of members and tens of thousands of posts per day. You get a stack of DMCA takedown requests every day. Do you think it's feasible for you to scrutinize each and every one, and take a moral stand on those you deem 'not procedurally valid' ? How much do you think that might cost? What happens when you call one wrong and the law comes to YOU?

For anything to really change, it's clear someone will have to go after the RIAA.. (EFF maybe?)

Post reply on HN