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Tech workers flee Belarus as IT haven takes authoritarian turn

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Re: Tech workers flee Belarus as IT haven takes authoritarian turn

#31

Post by sam_lowry_ »

ozim wrote: post #23
nomadrat wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And it's naive to say that there's no borders. You have to be qualified for the visa requirements. You also have to renew this visa every year or so. You have to start all over. Of course everything is possible with some effort and money, but i'm tired of seeing this term "no borders for it engineers".

Agree, it is no borders for "digital nomads" from first world countries having nice passports. Take into account COVID-19 pandemic and it is not as easy to move somewhere just now.

Neighboring Lithuania and Ukraine already eased visa regimes for Belarusians in hope to attrack highly skilled workers fleeing Lukashenka.

Re: Tech workers flee Belarus as IT haven takes authoritarian turn

#32

Post by Mediterraneo10 »

juniper_strong wrote: post #26
hpkuarg wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Man, Russia has way more people than I thought. For some reason I expected it to be less than 100 million total.

The Germans had that delusion too.

The Germans were well aware of Russia's population at the time. In the 1930s, the Germans produced a huge amount of areal-studies scholarship with regard to the USSR (demographics, ethnography, history, linguistics, etc.). Even today scholars occasionally rely on those papers and monographs, as distasteful as a publication produced under the Nazi regime might be.

No, the Germans’ delusion was that these many tens of millions of Soviet citizens were so unhappy with the regime, that they wouldn't rush to defend it.

Re: Tech workers flee Belarus as IT haven takes authoritarian turn

#33

Post by sam_lowry_ »

akira2501 wrote: post #24
nomadrat wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And it's naive to say that there's no borders. You have to be qualified for the visa requirements. You also have to renew this visa every year or so. You have to start all over. Of course everything is possible with some effort and money, but i'm tired of seeing this term "no borders for it engineers".

Yea, whoever wrote that never heard of a "language barrier." IT is not some universal language.

Language is not that much of a problem.

They all speak Russian. Lithuania has a sizable minority of Russian speakers, and has historical ties to Belarus. Latvia is predominantly Russian-speaking. Ukraine as well.

Knowing Belarusian, they can pick up Polish rather quickly.

As a last resort, Russia is still freer than Belarus politically and better off economically. Smolensk is half an hour drive from the Belarusian border.

Re: Tech workers flee Belarus as IT haven takes authoritarian turn

#34

Post by sam_lowry_ »

Ericson2314 wrote: post #27
WarOnPrivacy wrote: post #15

I have a theory that when news orgs nurture soft authoritarians (Bush/Patriot Act, Obama/espionage charges for whistleblowers) their weakened journalistic instincts leave a vacuum that's easy for harder line authoritarians to fill. That's what I believed happened in the US. I wonder if a similar process happened in Belarus.

What? There was no descent from liberalism in Belarus. It's been a dictatorship since shortly after the fall of the USSR. This is more like if Hu Jintao just became Xi Jingping.

Unfortunately, Lukashenka is closer to Pol Pot now than to Xi Jingping.

Re: Tech workers flee Belarus as IT haven takes authoritarian turn

#35

Post by nopriorarrests »

ashtonkem wrote: post #3
robinduckett wrote: post #2

I used to contract for a firm which made heavy use of Belarusian software dev teams, hopefully all is cool with the guys I used to work with :S

Same. It also seems like Belarus is killing the goose that laid the golden egg here, not that that’s surprising behavior from an authoritarian regime fighting for its life.

>It also seems like Belarus is killing the goose that laid the golden egg here

Meh. Belarus economy is heavy machinery and agriculture (mostly exported to russia).

IT for Belarus is as important as expensive watches industry for US economy.

Re: Tech workers flee Belarus as IT haven takes authoritarian turn

#36

Post by slezyr »

ozim wrote: post #6

“There’s no borders at all for IT engineers. They can find a job anywhere.” Uhm yeah, but they also have parents, siblings, girlfriends. Probably they might have some properties bought already. So as it may seem really advantageous to be in IT, one might not be able to move to another country just like that...

Not sure if he actually said this. There is no source and I can't find it in russian as well.

Re: Tech workers flee Belarus as IT haven takes authoritarian turn

#37

Post by mattmanser »

Mediterraneo10 wrote: post #32
juniper_strong wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Germans had that delusion too.

The Germans were well aware of Russia's population at the time. In the 1930s, the Germans produced a huge amount of areal-studies scholarship with regard to the USSR (demographics, ethnography, history, linguistics, etc.). Even today scholars occasionally rely on those papers and monographs, as distasteful as a publication produced under the Nazi regime might be. No, the Germans’ delusion was that these many tens of…

To be fair to them, Russia had gone through a civil war 19 years before. If you're listening to the exiles and losers, it's easy to get a false impression.

It's a mistake we've seen made through out history time and again (e.g. bay of pigs, CIA adownplaying Castro's popular support, etc.)

Re: Tech workers flee Belarus as IT haven takes authoritarian turn

#38

Post by [deleted] »

Mediterraneo10 wrote: post #32
juniper_strong wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Germans had that delusion too.

The Germans were well aware of Russia's population at the time. In the 1930s, the Germans produced a huge amount of areal-studies scholarship with regard to the USSR (demographics, ethnography, history, linguistics, etc.). Even today scholars occasionally rely on those papers and monographs, as distasteful as a publication produced under the Nazi regime might be. No, the Germans’ delusion was that these many tens of…

[deleted]

Re: Tech workers flee Belarus as IT haven takes authoritarian turn

#39

Post by agurk »

sam_lowry_ wrote: post #33
akira2501 wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yea, whoever wrote that never heard of a "language barrier." IT is not some universal language.

Language is not that much of a problem. They all speak Russian. Lithuania has a sizable minority of Russian speakers, and has historical ties to Belarus. Latvia is predominantly Russian-speaking. Ukraine as well. Knowing Belarusian, they can pick up Polish rather quickly. As a last resort, Russia is still freer than Belarus politically and better off economically. Smolensk is half an hour drive from the Belarusian bo…

While Russian is common it's not ubiquitous. Latvia is 26.9% ethnically Russian and 34% speak it at home. 27% of students are partially instructed in Russian. A referendum to adopt Russian as a 2nd offical language was voted against in 2012.

Lithuania is 5.8% Russian with 39% speaking it as a foreign language.

Numbers from Wikipedia.

Re: Tech workers flee Belarus as IT haven takes authoritarian turn

#40

Post by juniper_strong »

Mediterraneo10 wrote: post #32
juniper_strong wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Germans had that delusion too.

The Germans were well aware of Russia's population at the time. In the 1930s, the Germans produced a huge amount of areal-studies scholarship with regard to the USSR (demographics, ethnography, history, linguistics, etc.). Even today scholars occasionally rely on those papers and monographs, as distasteful as a publication produced under the Nazi regime might be. No, the Germans’ delusion was that these many tens of…

I was taught that when the Germans invaded, there were industrial cities in the Soviet Union that had been created after World War 1 that weren't even on the German maps at the time of the invasion, the Germans didn't know the extent of Soviet industrialization in the inter-war period. Is that all false?
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