Wait, in a modern democracy you can have an executive branch that's actually accountable for breaking laws? Huh...
Head of Danish intelligence suspended after whistleblowers hand over information
31–40 of 125 posts
Re: Head of Danish intelligence suspended after whistleblowers hand over information
#32Could you imagine a government agency spying on its own citizens? In America that would be illegal and unconstitutional. We would have to immediately defund that agency.
Imagine a country where you have zero power to elect officials and have no constitution, so you could never have oversight over it.
Oh wait, that’s the system (via China/Russia) that our intelligence agencies are helping protect us against.
Re: Head of Danish intelligence suspended after whistleblowers hand over information
#33Earlier quoted context omitted.
I was surprised to find reading a book called Intelligence in an Insecure World [0] that the general consensus amongst intelligence studies scholars is apparently that there's no empirical evidence for the effectiveness of intelligence work and there probably never will be (although I read the book some time ago so I might be misremembering it). [0] https://www.wiley.com/en-us/Intelligence+in+An+Insecure+Worl...
For those of us who haven't read the book, could you summarize please? Anecdotally that claim seems untrue. Intelligence services have had a tangible effect on world history.[1][2][3] 1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cryptanalysis_of_the_Enigma 2. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zimmermann_Telegram 3. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adolf_Eichmann#Capture
> Intelligence services have had a tangible effect on world history.[1][2][3]
You forgot the most important:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Midway
>Military historian John Keegan called it "the most stunning and decisive blow in the history of naval warfare",[9] [...] Most significantly, American cryptographers were able to determine the date and location of the planned attack, enabling the forewarned U.S. Navy to prepare its own ambush.
Re: Head of Danish intelligence suspended after whistleblowers hand over information
#34Earlier quoted context omitted.
is this a joke ? ever heard of the NSA ?
“Kids detect sarcasm at about age 6, but don’t begin to see the intended humour until around age 10,” - https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/08/070803141811.h...
> Poe's law is an adage of Internet culture stating that, without a clear indicator of the author's intent, it is impossible to create a parody of extreme views so obviously exaggerated that it cannot be mistaken by some readers for a sincere expression of the views being parodied. The original statement, by Nathan Poe, read:
> Without a winking smiley or other blatant display of humor, it is utterly impossible to parody a Creationist in such a way that someone won't mistake for the genuine article.
Re: Head of Danish intelligence suspended after whistleblowers hand over information
#35Earlier quoted context omitted.
Nope, it is not their job. If a citizen is accused in a crime, there are other institutions tasked with the investigation. Sometimes this is the counterintelligence, sometimes this is the police. However, breaking the law and actively avoiding legal supervision is a crime which makes them criminals.
Ok so we have to play by the rules to the absolute T. But our adversaries like China/Russia can play dirty and anyway they want, because you say justice is absolute and black and white. Great.
Have you ever thought that maybe there was a reason for those rules to be imposed?
It is really easy to put on the kindergarten act and to say that if the other side did it first, then it is okay. However, what is the difference between you and the other side then? The state has rather enormous power as it is and it is quite able to use it without letting the power trips of random individuals.
Re: Head of Danish intelligence suspended after whistleblowers hand over information
#36Earlier quoted context omitted.
For those of us who haven't read the book, could you summarize please? Anecdotally that claim seems untrue. Intelligence services have had a tangible effect on world history.[1][2][3] 1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cryptanalysis_of_the_Enigma 2. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zimmermann_Telegram 3. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adolf_Eichmann#Capture
> Intelligence services have had a tangible effect on world history.[1][2][3] You forgot the most important: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Midway >Military historian John Keegan called it "the most stunning and decisive blow in the history of naval warfare",[9] [...] Most significantly, American cryptographers were able to determine the date and location of the planned attack, enabling the forewarned U.S. N…
Good one. There are many more, I'm sure.
Re: Head of Danish intelligence suspended after whistleblowers hand over information
#37Could you imagine a government agency spying on its own citizens? In America that would be illegal and unconstitutional. We would have to immediately defund that agency.
Imagine a country where you have zero power to elect officials and have no constitution, so you could never have oversight over it. Oh wait, that’s the system (via China/Russia) that our intelligence agencies are helping protect us against.
Do you legitimately believe that US intelligence agencies are the bulwark against authoritarian government in the US?
Re: Head of Danish intelligence suspended after whistleblowers hand over information
#38Earlier quoted context omitted.
Ok so we have to play by the rules to the absolute T. But our adversaries like China/Russia can play dirty and anyway they want, because you say justice is absolute and black and white. Great.
Have you ever thought that maybe there was a reason for those rules to be imposed? It is really easy to put on the kindergarten act and to say that if the other side did it first, then it is okay. However, what is the difference between you and the other side then? The state has rather enormous power as it is and it is quite able to use it without letting the power trips of random individuals.
If you understand these programs they have... they do a meta-analysis of huge amounts of data. So while they use your data, there isn’t somebody personally looking at your data.
Whereas China/Russia has people tracking dissidents etc.
Not even in the same realm.
Im saying give a more nuanced legal approach so we can defend ourselves.
Re: Head of Danish intelligence suspended after whistleblowers hand over information
#39Earlier quoted context omitted.
It shouldn't. There's no political gain for any of the major parties. It also happens after several, relatively minor, cases of corruption and nepotism in the military and intelligence services (former high-ranking official just got 3months prison today). It stinks mostly of a corruption and several decades of lack of proper oversight
What kind of targets is he accused of targetting?
Are there "kinds" that are not covered by the law and are more okay to have their rights abused?
Re: Head of Danish intelligence suspended after whistleblowers hand over information
#40Earlier quoted context omitted.
Imagine a country where you have zero power to elect officials and have no constitution, so you could never have oversight over it. Oh wait, that’s the system (via China/Russia) that our intelligence agencies are helping protect us against.
Do you legitimately believe that US intelligence agencies are the bulwark against authoritarian government in the US?
No, I meant they are part of the bulwark against countries like China/Russia taking over the world.