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The death of corporate research labs

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Re: The death of corporate research labs

#31
I work for one of the last traditional corporate research labs in Silicon Valley, and I consider myself very fortunate to have my position, especially in the time of COVID-19. I love doing research. But I fear losing my job, partly because I don't know where I'd find another research position in light of the 30-year decline of industrial research combined with the impending budget cuts that will hit academia starting with this upcoming school year.

I've noticed a profound shift in the past decade away from corporate research labs such as IBM Labs and HP Labs where they worked on medium-term projects developing research prototypes that were sometimes passed onto product teams. In their place, companies such as Google have pioneered a different model of research (https://research.google/pubs/pub38149/), where PhDs are hired as software engineers who solve research problems and write production code, focusing more on shipping production code rather than writing papers (although there have been many great papers that have come out of Google, most notably the MapReduce and Spanner papers). I'm noticing that the vast majority of my PhD-holding friends in computer science are hired as software engineers rather than as researchers. The ones who started out at places like IBM Labs or HP Labs with the titles "Members of Technical Staff" would often end up taking positions at other companies as software engineers.

This development may be fine for researchers who want to work on production code and who don't mind de-emphasizing publishing in exchange of product development. However, what about researchers who want to focus on solving research problems that cannot immediately be applied to products? I'm finding that there's decreasing room for these types of researchers in this economy. More companies have a short-term mindset these days, partly due to changes in management style (e.g., the rise of Carly Fiorina-style CEOs), but also due to the fact that the computer industry has shown repeatedly that large 800-pound gorillas can be taken down by smaller companies. "Why invest in long-term research and long-term planning if there is no guarantee of a long-term future" is the logic of many companies, big and small. The alternative to industry is academia, but there are only so many professorships available, and for those professors, there is only so much NSF grant money to go around, which is highly competitive to earn. Professors at research universities spend a lot of time fundraising; it costs a lot of money building and maintaining a lab that is resourceful enough to perform the research and publish the results necessary to gain tenure.

Short of a major cultural change where companies are encouraged to invest in research at the levels that Xerox and AT&T did back in the 1970s and where we see an expansion of academia similar to the post-WWII boom (which is unlikely in the United States), the future I see for those wanting to work on problems that don't lead to immediate productization is independent research done on a researcher's spare time when not being engaged in "money-making" activity. After all, Einstein did brilliant work while he was a patent examiner, and Yitang Zhang did amazing research while being employed as an untenured lecturer. I would advise today's computer science PhD students of this current reality of research employment. If one wants to work on self-directed research projects, then that person must be willing to have a self-funded research career; all researchers need to be concerned with funding whether that funding comes in the form of a direct salary, a grant, or indirectly through the salary of an unrelated job.

Re: The death of corporate research labs

#32

I am curious what the author thinks about the same problem in pharma/biotech. On the one hand, they are kind of _forced_ to do research in one form or another to power the pipelines, so clearly corporate research is still alive there. However, given the pathetic track record the industry seems to hace, and arguably complete lack of any real innovation (almost all of the drugs in most pipelines are just antibodies or…

I think you’re really not giving L’Oreal the credit it deserves. It’s much more than just a lipstick vendor. Sanofi, Europe’s largest pharma company, has its roots in L’Oreal (L’Oreal previously was the parent company of Synthelabo, which used to be the #3 pharma company in Europe until it merged with Sanofi).

L’Oreal also does research in things like methods to regrow human skin/hair, which aren’t on the same level as cancer treatments, but they do involve clinical trials and medical research. Hell, even something like launching a new facial moisturizer requires testing akin to clinical trials.

Aside from that, Emma Walmsley wasn’t CEO at L’Oreal, and she left there in 2010 to join GSK, where she worked for 7 years before being promoted to CEO in 2017. It’s not as if she went from being some business bean counter straight into being the head of GSK; she had 7 years to build GSK domain knowledge before taking the helm.

Re: The death of corporate research labs

#33

Why would ad companies need research labs?

At the minimum: to find more effective ways at getting people to purchase those products being advertised. There's been a lot of interesting research done on recommender systems and data mining that have been fueled by the growth of the ad-funded Web.

Eventually, though, once a company gets large enough, it needs to diversify in order for it to not be totally dependent on one revenue stream, lest it find that stream disrupted in the future. Apple used to be strictly a personal computer company; now it sells not only computers, but it sells smartphones, tablets, headphones, smartwatches, and other consumer electronics, as well as provides services for a fee. Google has a lot of activities, and Facebook has been branching out into VR through its Oculus acquisition.

Having a research lab could be helpful with exploring other areas that the company could branch out into.

Re: The death of corporate research labs

#34
Holdup. Lack of anti-trust enforcement is blamed (among other things) for the end of corporate R&D, but Monopoly breakup is exactly what killed Bell labs! 9 smaller companies weren't going to fund their own lab, and the only reason the lab existed was to find new markets to explore. In fact, nearly all of the examples of successful R&D labs came from corporations that so dominated their industry they put money into finding new investments: Xerox. Kodak Eastmann. Google might meet this definition.

I think we also overrate the significance of the corporate labs. There are not a lot of successful examples where the host company actually profited from the invention. Just a lot that bungled them or prematurely killed them (like when AT&T almost invented the internet). Or snuck out accidentally (like the Xerox Alto).

Re: The death of corporate research labs

#35

I am curious what the author thinks about the same problem in pharma/biotech. On the one hand, they are kind of _forced_ to do research in one form or another to power the pipelines, so clearly corporate research is still alive there. However, given the pathetic track record the industry seems to hace, and arguably complete lack of any real innovation (almost all of the drugs in most pipelines are just antibodies or…

There’s a school of thought that CEOs don’t matter, or matter much less than we might have imagined.

Further reading: https://duckduckgo.com/?q=ceos+dont+matter&t=h_&ia=web

Re: The death of corporate research labs

#36

The corporate research labs have been replaced with the likes of DeepMind (hell bent on doing research only in neural networks) and Google X (personal playground of the company's founder with no known scientific or business output). The fact that big tech does not invest in basic research anymore does not bode well for the future of big tech.

There's this other division of the corporation you might be interested in called Google Research.

Re: The death of corporate research labs

#37

I am curious what the author thinks about the same problem in pharma/biotech. On the one hand, they are kind of _forced_ to do research in one form or another to power the pipelines, so clearly corporate research is still alive there. However, given the pathetic track record the industry seems to hace, and arguably complete lack of any real innovation (almost all of the drugs in most pipelines are just antibodies or…

> TBH I can't for the life of me figure out how someone who sold lipsticks can make decisions on which preclinical trial has the highest chance of success in a human being.

I'd say a CEO's job is to hire someone who is qualified to make those decisions, and to make sure there's enough money to keep the lights on so they can do that job.

In that respect, running a company like L'Oreal isn't so irrelevant.

Not saying your broader point is wrong though. Someone needs to have a vision for the future, and I'm not sure you can really have a strong vision without having been through the trenches yourself.

Re: The death of corporate research labs

#38

Holdup. Lack of anti-trust enforcement is blamed (among other things) for the end of corporate R&D, but Monopoly breakup is exactly what killed Bell labs! 9 smaller companies weren't going to fund their own lab, and the only reason the lab existed was to find new markets to explore. In fact, nearly all of the examples of successful R&D labs came from corporations that so dominated their industry they put money into f…

Anti-trust enforcement can take many forms -- breaking companies up is just one of the most extreme and obvious ones -- but often just the threat of action was enough since for a while the US government backed it up.

A big reason Bell Labs was created and perpetuated was because AT&T feared being broken up. Bell Labs was effectively a PR vehicle they used to show the US government that they were giving back to the community, and an excuse to continue operating as a de-facto state-sanctioned monopoly. Today's toothless FTC and DoJ don't really inspire that kind of fear.

Source (sort of, paraphrased) - This is a big theme of The Idea Factory which describes the heyday of Bell Labs.

(Edited to further develop my thought)

Re: The death of corporate research labs

#39
Have they ever been alive, though? They seem more of a PR stunt, to show shareholders that the company is invested in the future.

In my country, if you land a job in such a lab, you know you can bullshit around and play with with some stuff. But nothing will ever come out of it. For profit, the corporation will acquire some product or startup.

If you really want to innovate freely, found your own startup. With the additional benefit of reaping the money yourself.

Re: The death of corporate research labs

#40

Holdup. Lack of anti-trust enforcement is blamed (among other things) for the end of corporate R&D, but Monopoly breakup is exactly what killed Bell labs! 9 smaller companies weren't going to fund their own lab, and the only reason the lab existed was to find new markets to explore. In fact, nearly all of the examples of successful R&D labs came from corporations that so dominated their industry they put money into f…

Just about everything in the article doesn’t pass a sniff test to me.

Aside from the issue you mentioned, the article seems to be making the claim that we have less innovation today. Which just seems like a ridiculous claim to me.

It also mentions “pervasive short-termism” as an obstacle. It might be in large public companies, but it’s certainly not in the private equity markets. Innovative companies have access to huge amounts of capital, and can stay unprofitable for such a long period of time that many people think we’re in a bubble. Multi-billion dollar valuation and “may never be profitable” is perfectly ordinary these days, and certainly doesn’t lend any credibility to the authors argument.

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