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Sleep is more important than food

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Re: Sleep is more important than food

#31

Post by eru »

nopassrecover wrote: post #8

"So how much sleep do you need? When researchers put test subjects in environments without clocks or windows and ask them to sleep any time they feel tired, 95 percent sleep between seven and eight hours out of every 24. Another 2.5 percent sleep more than eight hours." The broken link there is meant to point to ( http://www.sleepfoundation.org/article/how-sleep-works/how-m... ) and I can't spot where it mentions thi…

I read about some such experiments. Some people actually preferred it, and used the distraction free environment to finish their PhD theses.

Re: Sleep is more important than food

#33

Post by jules »

haploid wrote: post #20
nopassrecover wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If it affects peak physical performance, it seems reasonable to suspect it affects peak mental performance (as studies seem to suggest). High functioning executives might get by on little sleep, but would they perform better on more sleep? Are hours clocked more important than output at the executive level?

No, it doesn't seem reasonable at all. Athletic activity causes actual physical microdamage that takes rest time, nutrition, and hormones to repair. The elevated secretion of human growth hormone during REM sleep is a significant reason why athletes perform better on more sleep. No such analogue exists for the human brain. Mental activities, at worst, deplete neurotransmitter levels. I have seen no evidence to sugges…

I thought it was well known that sleep plays a very important role in learning?

Re: Sleep is more important than food

#35

Post by mjfern »

winestock wrote: post #3

Schools such as Caltech and MIT have rigorous curricula that proverbially requires constant study every day of the week just to stay in the middle of the pack. Naturally, most students cut back on sleep. Proponents of this approach are aware of this, even boast about it, saying that this is the best way to learn the material. On the other hand, numerous studies -- including the link at the top of this page -- conclud…

Even more disconcerting is the sleeping culture/routine throughout medical residency and fellowship; arguably, the most important stages of medical education, where doctors in training learn the hands-on skills to practice medicine. Despite the importance of learning during this stage, individuals are routinely sleep-deprived:

"20% of all residents reported sleeping an average of 5 hours or less per night, with 66% averaging 6 hours or less per night. Residents averaging 5 or fewer hours of sleep per night were more likely to report serious accidents or injuries, conflict with other professional staff, use of alcohol, use of medications to stay awake, noticeable weight change, working in an "impaired condition," and having made significant medical errors." - http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15124713

A Wikipedia article focused on medical resident work hours: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medical_resident_work_hours

Re: Sleep is more important than food

#36

Post by jules »

haploid wrote: post #17
brd wrote: post #2

"Sleep is important" has been a recurring theme for the last couple of years but I am one of the few that don't buy into it at all. Maybe I fall into the 2.5% but if I sleep 8+ hours I feel overslept and groggy. I function moderately to exceptionally well on 6 hours of sleep and often times end up getting more like 3-5 hours of sleep. I've read articles about high functioning executives that barely sleep at all and s…

I am in absolute agreement with this. I find that if I sleep more than 6 hours a night, I am actually more tired the following day. Normally, I get 5 hours per night and I rarely experience low levels of functioning or excessive fatigue. And as other have pointed out, the methodology of the cited experiment in the article is highly suspect. Any normal human being, locked in a room with no stimuli, is likely to sleep…

At a time when I was sleep deprived I felt completely OK. When I caught up on the sleep I felt worse. I think it's because sleep deprivation also deprives you of the ability to notice the negative effects well enough.

That's probably not what's happening with you if you naturally sleep 5 hours per night without an alarm though. If you are using an alarm, you should try sleeping as long as your body feels like for two weeks. Don't block sunlight from your windows, let the sun make sure you wake up if your body thinks you've slept enough. If your body thinks you are still not rested, it will keep you asleep even in sunlight.

Re: Sleep is more important than food

#37

Post by nopassrecover »

haploid wrote: post #20
nopassrecover wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If it affects peak physical performance, it seems reasonable to suspect it affects peak mental performance (as studies seem to suggest). High functioning executives might get by on little sleep, but would they perform better on more sleep? Are hours clocked more important than output at the executive level?

No, it doesn't seem reasonable at all. Athletic activity causes actual physical microdamage that takes rest time, nutrition, and hormones to repair. The elevated secretion of human growth hormone during REM sleep is a significant reason why athletes perform better on more sleep. No such analogue exists for the human brain. Mental activities, at worst, deplete neurotransmitter levels. I have seen no evidence to sugges…

Yet people perform worse mentally without sleep - why would that be if sleep was not vital to mental performance? Have you never needed a nap or coffee to refresh your mind? Do you deny a physical influence on mental faculties?

Re: Sleep is more important than food

#38

Post by econner »

winestock wrote: post #3

Schools such as Caltech and MIT have rigorous curricula that proverbially requires constant study every day of the week just to stay in the middle of the pack. Naturally, most students cut back on sleep. Proponents of this approach are aware of this, even boast about it, saying that this is the best way to learn the material. On the other hand, numerous studies -- including the link at the top of this page -- conclud…

I think there is a kind of availability heuristic effect going on here. You hear about people who regularly pull all-nighters because they do boast about them so that it seems more prevalent than is actually the case.

You don't hear the student bragging about how he got enough sleep last night and got all of his work done ahead of time.

I'm an undergrad at Stanford and I think that if you plan ahead well enough it isn't difficult to get enough sleep and get all your work done. It's not only about managing time during the term, but also about managing which classes you take together term-to-term.

There is also something to be said for developing endurance. Eventually you're going to have to do something you don't want to do while incredibly tired.. so pulling all-nighters is a kind of training for that.

Re: Sleep is more important than food

#39

Post by bvi »

giu wrote: post #10

A tool I've been using for the past days: http://sleepyti.me/ I'm currently testing it. The last two days I went to bed at a time which the tool suggested; getting up wasn't much of an issue, and I felt some improvements, but it's definitely too early to say that it works for me.

Placebo effect, more than anything else.

Re: Sleep is more important than food

#40

Post by kenjackson »

michaeldhopkins wrote: post #28
haploid wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, it doesn't seem reasonable at all. Athletic activity causes actual physical microdamage that takes rest time, nutrition, and hormones to repair. The elevated secretion of human growth hormone during REM sleep is a significant reason why athletes perform better on more sleep. No such analogue exists for the human brain. Mental activities, at worst, deplete neurotransmitter levels. I have seen no evidence to sugges…

For mental work, sleep is not replenishment, it's prep work. Your brain is thinking problems while you sleep.

Not only that, sleep also appears to be when your brain reinforces what you've learned... over and over again.
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