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The Diminishing Returns of Everything

stevenshang.com

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Re: The Diminishing Returns of Everything

#31
> The only exception to this rule I can think of is McDonald's fries. The more you eat, the better they become. It is true.

Potato chips are, to me, an even more perfect example of this effect. They are engineering marvels. If a food is too salty, you eventually crave something sweet. Too sweet and you get tired and want salt. Potato chips take the sweetness of potato starch and add just the right amount of salt to keep you balanced.

The satisfying crunchiness gives way to carby creaminess, which then promptly dissolves entirely, leaving you feeling like you haven't consumed anything at all [1], so surely one more chip is OK, right?

Potato chips are my crack. If I could eat them unburdened by shame or the desire to take care of my health, I would eat them until I burst.

[1]: https://www.nytimes.com/2013/02/24/magazine/the-extraordinar...

Re: The Diminishing Returns of Everything

#32

This is disingenuous. Sure, the first X hours of working on a new project are a lot of fun and you can set up the framework for what you're doing and feel like you're making great progress. But what you're missing is detail and quality. For example, I can set up the structure of my thesis by working out chapter titles, headings, subheadings and drafting bullet points per section. Straightforward. But doing the resear…

You're misusing the word "disingenuous". The author has no ill intention of being insincere.

Simplifying, "The author has no intention of being insincere."

Or perhaps even, "The author is not insincere."

Or alternatively, "The author is sincere."

Re: The Diminishing Returns of Everything

#33
As it is with many things this is both right and wrong depending on how you look at it.

Consider something like Brazilian Jiu Jitsu. The first 1000 hours will surely advance your game percentage-wise way more than the 1000 hours you accomplish after you've put 10k hours in.

However, there aren't many people with 10k of bjj practice and you're no longer in the rookie world. That 1k may make you just 1% better but that 1% means a lot among the elite.

Re: The Diminishing Returns of Everything

#34
Re: the voice activated light class of idea. I have a weird NIH/hoarding bug. I always try to do thing on my own (am now making electrical circuits). Somehow it's a huge waste of time. Yet I know a ton of stuff and can fix some things, or avoid fear and scams.

One alternative is a hub of DIYers. Remember the story of how Xerox PARC operated ? unattended, unmanaged.. you had an idea or a problem you ping people around that know that domain, chat around and make a thing. In groups it might turn diminishing returns into a massive life enhancement (in theory, I never worked in such an environment).

ps: I actually think that picking this kind of projects is a tiny art. Don't scratch all itches but know that knowing is always a good thing.

Re: The Diminishing Returns of Everything

#35

> The only exception to this rule I can think of is McDonald's fries. The more you eat, the better they become. It is true. Potato chips are, to me, an even more perfect example of this effect. They are engineering marvels. If a food is too salty, you eventually crave something sweet. Too sweet and you get tired and want salt. Potato chips take the sweetness of potato starch and add just the right amount of salt to k…

It feels like some foods have fervent followings despite contributing to things like heart disease. It's a good example of how humans get thrown off when dealing with decades long timespans of bad choices that add up, except with food we all have to eat.

I recall that when processed meats including bacon were classified as carcinogens, people basically said "screw that, it's bacon for crying out loud." I'm not sure to what extent they were joking. I personally avoid all processed meats, but to me the public sentiment over some unhealthy foods is in stark contrast to public sentiment over smoking or alcoholism.

One time I searched something to the effect of "why are potato chips unhealthy" and got back a general sentiment of "well, they're not that bad for you, as long as it's only once in a while." I feel like with this attitude it adds up over time though. It's probably not possible to pin down exactly what foods caused a heart attack, as opposed to being able to more clearly associate lung cancer with a smoking addiction.

With smoking it provides no real benefit except lessening the craving for another smoke. With unhealthy foods everyone has to eat, so maybe you'd be more forgiven for eating them than throwing away your health on something not essential to survival. Fancy ice cream parlors are the norm, and nobody is going to lobby politicians to close them down in the name of public health. It's just ice cream, served by people working out of food trucks trying to make a living. The most they do is insitute soda taxes. God forbid soda itself is banned.

Is there an illustration on how foods like potato chips affect health long-term? Something like the study that estimates every cigarette takes eleven minutes off your lifespan. There are a lot of different foods to cover though. I feel like if there was data stating every potato chip took X seconds off my lifespan it would be easier to deny myself from buying them by looking through the items at the supermarket and being able to think "17 minutes, 22 minutes."

When I think of someone beginning to smoke I imagine them being told "you're going down a path that will almost certainly kill you down the line." When I imagine someone being a regular at an artisan donut shop I imagine people asking them how the taste was.

Re: The Diminishing Returns of Everything

#36
post #30

> The same goes for abs. The first ten thousand set-ups you do just may give you that 6-pack abs you want, but another thirty thousand sure won't get you the 7-pack. He picked the one type of exercise which doesn't really change. If you're lifting or running, you see increasing returns for a long time. You get stronger by lifting heavy weights, and you need to lift light weights to be able to lift heavy weights.

It's also a bad example because pack number is determined largely by genetics and visibility is largely determined by diet. Look at Arnold in his Mr Olympia days, he only had a 5-pack.

Re: The Diminishing Returns of Everything

#37

> The only exception to this rule I can think of is McDonald's fries. The more you eat, the better they become. It is true. Potato chips are, to me, an even more perfect example of this effect. They are engineering marvels. If a food is too salty, you eventually crave something sweet. Too sweet and you get tired and want salt. Potato chips take the sweetness of potato starch and add just the right amount of salt to k…

It feels like some foods have fervent followings despite contributing to things like heart disease. It's a good example of how humans get thrown off when dealing with decades long timespans of bad choices that add up, except with food we all have to eat. I recall that when processed meats including bacon were classified as carcinogens, people basically said "screw that, it's bacon for crying out loud." I'm not sure t…

> I recall that when processed meats including bacon were classified as carcinogens, people basically said "screw that, it's bacon for crying out loud." I'm not sure to what extent they were joking.

I love bacon. I know it's unhealthy. I still eat it.

You seem to be coming from a perspective where the only goal is to maximize life. But that's not how people operate. People are trying to maximize living.

I could probably live to 110 if I ate nothing but tofu and mineral water and lived in a sanitized bubble. But would I even want to?

I don't want to make choices so unhealthy that they significantly impact the quality and length of my life. But I sure as hell want to pack as many experiences as I can before I reach that point. Some of those experiences are going to take their toll on my body. That's the price you pay for living and for many experiences, the price is worth it.

Personally, I don't think it is for cigarettes. (And, in particular, it is certainly not fair to make people in the vicinity of smokers pay that price.) But many people love the sensation of smoking. I do think it's worth the price to have some bacon with breakfast and a whiskey nightcap before bed.

> I feel like if there was data stating every potato chip took X seconds off my lifespan it would be easier to deny myself from buying them by looking through the items at the supermarket and being able to think "17 minutes, 22 minutes."

You are describing a dystopian nightmare. Can you imagine this applied to every choice you make? You see a cute person on the other end of the bar and a little chat bubble appears in your personal heads-up-display "They will break up with you two years after you begin dating." You look at a cute puppy at a shelter. "She will die young of congenital heart disease."

Re: The Diminishing Returns of Everything

#38

> The only exception to this rule I can think of is McDonald's fries. The more you eat, the better they become. It is true. Potato chips are, to me, an even more perfect example of this effect. They are engineering marvels. If a food is too salty, you eventually crave something sweet. Too sweet and you get tired and want salt. Potato chips take the sweetness of potato starch and add just the right amount of salt to k…

It feels like some foods have fervent followings despite contributing to things like heart disease. It's a good example of how humans get thrown off when dealing with decades long timespans of bad choices that add up, except with food we all have to eat. I recall that when processed meats including bacon were classified as carcinogens, people basically said "screw that, it's bacon for crying out loud." I'm not sure t…

Even professionals devoted to measuring life with statistics try to adjust it for "quality", subjective as that may be.

People who live a long time, because of healthy lifestyles, genetics, and modern medicine, often spend a very long time at the end that is really miserable and pointless.

I feel like either you should know what that is like, from knowing people in their 80s or 90s, or you should know that you don't know. If you spend some time visiting a nursing home, do you ever think "gee, every additional month, or year, or decade that I might spend in a place like this is worth any sacrifice in the prime of my life"?

Re: The Diminishing Returns of Everything

#39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It feels like some foods have fervent followings despite contributing to things like heart disease. It's a good example of how humans get thrown off when dealing with decades long timespans of bad choices that add up, except with food we all have to eat. I recall that when processed meats including bacon were classified as carcinogens, people basically said "screw that, it's bacon for crying out loud." I'm not sure t…

> I recall that when processed meats including bacon were classified as carcinogens, people basically said "screw that, it's bacon for crying out loud." I'm not sure to what extent they were joking. I love bacon. I know it's unhealthy. I still eat it. You seem to be coming from a perspective where the only goal is to maximize life. But that's not how people operate. People are trying to maximize living . I could prob…

"I could probably live to 110"

The problem is, if you get an extra 20 years, they aren't added on between say 40 and 50. The years from 90 to 110 aren't going to be much fun.

Re: The Diminishing Returns of Everything

#40

I don't really like the emphasis on "wasting" time, the way he wrote it in the bathroom light automation section. If you do not enjoy tinkering with voice activation (or X thing in the general sense), then I can see why you wouldn't like losing time, but I would probably feel like it was 5 hours spent learning about home automation and voice control, which could maybe be applicable in other cases, both within home au…

Not all time can be considered equal. Let us say that one of my team spent two weeks building tooling that might save us a single day on two occasions. That might still be worth it if that day saved is part of some time pressured work.

You can think of this as the classic engineering 'latency vs throughput' tradeoff. We're spending a bit of throughput to get an improvement in latency.

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