Live data from Hacker News

Life Without Children

medium.com

31–40 of 48 posts

Re: Life Without Children

#31

Anyone who finds themselves tending towards this nihilistic, fatalistic worldview desperately needs to recognise the extremely harmful predicament they find themselves in and work instead towards a life of meaning and purpose. I would further urge them to reflect on who is playing the fiddle that is leading them down this terrible path so that they can go forward with knowledge of their enemy. Children are your purpo…

> in your children, and their children after them, you will live on forever. Just as your ancestors do in you.

No you won't, and no they don't. Most people will be forgotten within a couple of generations -- or are you well-versed in the lives of your great-great grandparents? Your genes, random and (thus, probably) non-special as they are, will be insignificant within four generations.

> You know that pang in your chest when you see the beautiful family walking down the street?

Kids or not, unless you're incredibly skilled and/or lucky, your contribution to the world will be forgotten within a couple of hundred years and likely much sooner. Once you come to terms with that, life gets much better. Be kind to people, make thoughtful choices, and live the best life you can today.

Re: Life Without Children

#32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We have two kids, my partner is a stay at home parent (their choice), and I earn enough on a single income for our family to enjoy a reasonably high quality of life in a low cost of living locale. You’re absolutely right that kids are expensive. They are a choice, and to each their own. Agreed, there are serious problems to solve (healthcare, income and wealth inequality, clean energy, electric mobility, justice and…

I don't think your choice is wrong. I'm saying we made the choice that's right for us. If we're lucky, she and I both have at most about 60 years left on this earth. Any kids we would have today could possibly be alive 100 years from now. With the trajectory we're on with climate change, inequality, global instability, etc. , we just didn't think it was a responsible choice for us to procreate. You and I may know we'…

[deleted]

Re: Life Without Children

#33
post #12

Having kids is definitely a major inconvenience and huge financial burden, that's for sure. If you look it from that perspective, then there are almost only cons and no pros. But if this the only perspective you can look at this, then you are probably not ready to have kids yet.

One person's major inconvenience is someone else's great delight.

Re: Life Without Children

#34
post #12

Having kids is definitely a major inconvenience and huge financial burden, that's for sure. If you look it from that perspective, then there are almost only cons and no pros. But if this the only perspective you can look at this, then you are probably not ready to have kids yet.

You're right. One person's major inconvenience is someone else's great delight.

Re: Life Without Children

#35
post #19

> It’s not a great world to be raising kids right now. This seems to be like one absolutely weird and baseless moral panic. What was good time then? During medieval times/WW1/WW2/60s/80/90s? If any, world's been the same all the time. The have-nots being looted by those who have 'em. Just that the tech makes it a lot visible, is all.

The older I get the more I see very real parallels between maladies of the human brain and maladies of human society.

The way I see it, all this weird and baseless moral panic you've identified tends to resemble clinical depression in an individual. People through their own analysis abstract out what they perceive to be problems, then they market and promote their perceived problems to others and all the hope and despair that comes from learning to perceive those things as problems. Next thing you know, society starts looking like it is clinically depressed and you get people spouting viewpoints like "this is the worst time ever to raise children".

In a similar vein, the experience of schizophrenia seems to parallel the authoritative information "dilemma" known as "fake news" that we're struggling with as a society. Fake news is now pervasive on both the left and the right either in the form of outright lies at worst to deliberate omission of counterbalancing information to serve and agenda. I'm reminded of this Quora question where people with schizophrenia describe what it's like to be schizophrenic:

https://www.quora.com/What-is-it-like-to-have-schizophrenia-...

Re: Life Without Children

#36
post #4

>It’s not a great world to be raising kids right now. It's never been a great world to raise children in. Years ago the child mortality rate meant every family had a Jimmy that wouldn't make it to age 5. It bugs me no end when people assert without citation that the world is worse than it ever was. One thing to keep in mind is that our awareness of the bad things in the world has certainly gone up due to our digital…

This. It baffles me how people seem to think the world is just getting worse and worse. The person mentions school pressure, only a few centuries ago in the western world many children were working in factories!

Re: Life Without Children

#37
I have children, and I enjoy them. Both my wife and I have well paid jobs in the tech industry.

Having children requires sacrifices. As with any decision, there is an inevitable cost of opportunity, but what we get from caring for these loved little human beings... Is priceless!

I understand the narrative of the author. This is a narrative of an individual whose core values are "success", material accumulation as proof of it, and individual freedoms. It is true, having children will require a lot of "operation expenses", and much of the time available for "yourself" needs to be invested into your children. I respect that for some people it is not a sacrifice that they are willing to do, and I don't think people should have children because it is the next step.

But I see a problem in this narrative, and it is that it describes having children as a mistake. Again, it is a mistake for the author, but I can hardly see how it is a "universal mistake". It reminds me a bit of game theory, and the idea of "Nash's equilibrium": Players are the society as a whole, some choose to have kids, some choose not to have kids, both have a penalty, yet in the long run they both benefit from their choices (individually and mutually).

I am also concerned about empathy. Daily I realize how difficult it is for some people without children to understand my choice, and the sacrifices it requires. Yes I am happy with my choice, but lack of empathy makes it particularly difficult to avoid choices with a larger cost than it should: Should I stay with my kids when they are sick? Or go to that meeting that is (as most meetings) better done as an email ;). My kids need me, emotionally. If I am with them, I am making a world of a difference for them... and in the future for society, because they will have safe attachment!

The reality is Humanity needs people to choose to have children, not all of us, some of us. We, having children, need empathy, recognition, and help from society. I don't think science and technology are going to solve the need for childhood anytime soon.

But I understand, you don't want to have kids. Good for you! Some people will even thank you, don't succumb to the pressure to have them "because it is next", and most importantly... Please don't forget you are here because someone did the best they could to bring you to this world (and probably made some mistakes, but mostly, they just wanted the best for you).

PS: It also comes to mind "Sapiens: A Brief History of Humankind" by Yuval Harari... Not so much on topic, but I like the door it opens for empathy via the understanding of different narratives, and how they are just constructs.

Re: Life Without Children

#38
What's strange to me is how the insecure the child free crowd seems to be regarding their choice. The seemingly never ending need to patronizingly justify that choice, to the point of moralizing the issue (as the author does), is bizarre. It comes off like the individual is seeking reassurance for their life choice. This isn't the 1950s. No one cares if you decide to have children or not.

Re: Life Without Children

#39

This article sits weird with me. I am not having kids, nor is my partner. We are both medically unable to do so. I never really wanted to have kids, however this article is full of cons and almost zero pros to having a kid, something OP seems to have not even thought of. Are kids a massive responsibility? Yes. Can they be a burden? Yes. Can they also bring parents an immense amount of joy, happiness, pride and adjace…

I don't think I've ever seen an article on life without children that deals with the fact that the friends you make growing up and into your twenties and thirties will have kids and you won't. And you will be aliens to each other.

Re: Life Without Children

#40
Parenting isn't for everyone so I don't judge.

But for me it happened to be most amazing thing in my life so far.

Clearly, the posted article is not very serious, the list of cons seem very shallow as compared to the deep lifelong joys that may come of parenthood.

My first child was unplanned and unwanted by me anyway. Having a child in college was definitely not part of my Grand Plan. I wasn't on speaking terms with his mom but thankfully she still invited me to his birth. As soon as I saw his bloody little head my life changed for the better forever. Then I went home to get some sleep before a calculus final.

Now, thirty years later, with only one daughter remaining in college, my wife and I have plenty of time and money to enjoy our freedom. Though not a second goes by that I don't miss my babies.

Post reply on HN