[flagged]
Buzzword king, I see.
WeWork Needed a Bailout, But Adam Neumann Still Leaves a Billionaire
31–40 of 105 posts
Re: WeWork Needed a Bailout, But Adam Neumann Still Leaves a Billionaire
#32There is another less discussed downside to Vision Fund’s reckless spending and overvaluation of startups. While Travis & Adam make their billions, the employees at Uber and WeWork are granted overvalued options and stock that subsequently crashes. The Uber stock is still below where it was 5 years ago and may never recover. The WeWork stock will likely never recover. As an employee, I would avoid working for a compa…
Every time I see these shenanigans it validates my position of turning options into cash if I’m above water ASAP, and getting as much of my raises into base salary as possible.
Twice burned (2001, 2009)...
Re: WeWork Needed a Bailout, But Adam Neumann Still Leaves a Billionaire
#33Earlier quoted context omitted.
I've been saying for years that stock grants/options/RSUs are like playing the lotto, and salary/benefits are more important. They're also a tool to keep people in roles they no longer want, because of a promise of a great payoff someday.
Especially for companies that aren’t public yet so there’s no guarantee that you’ll be able to exercise ever, even if it does become profitable and worth real money.
What prevents you from exercising options in the success case?
You might not be able to sell the shares you receive, but you should be able to exercise and hold them.
You might do this to manage tax exposure (to get the clock started on long term capital gains treatment and to make further gains capital rather than earned income).
Re: WeWork Needed a Bailout, But Adam Neumann Still Leaves a Billionaire
#34There is another less discussed downside to Vision Fund’s reckless spending and overvaluation of startups. While Travis & Adam make their billions, the employees at Uber and WeWork are granted overvalued options and stock that subsequently crashes. The Uber stock is still below where it was 5 years ago and may never recover. The WeWork stock will likely never recover. As an employee, I would avoid working for a compa…
Every time I see these shenanigans it validates my position of turning options into cash if I’m above water ASAP, and getting as much of my raises into base salary as possible. Twice burned (2001, 2009)...
I completely agree. I recommend selling along the way. You may lose some upside, but you definitely lose some downside.
Unfortunately, WeWork employees aren’t given that choice. They are getting fired with underwater options while Adam makes billions. I wonder how he can rationalize this to himself.
Re: WeWork Needed a Bailout, But Adam Neumann Still Leaves a Billionaire
#35[flagged]
This isn't a failure of capitalism, its just due to blind optimism and lack of governance with people falling under the spell of a charismatic CEO imho. If it had worked, everyone would be saying this guys a genius.
I looked at WeWork at one stage for an office, the prices seemed crazy, I didn't understand how any one was using it, you've been able to get serviced offices for years for way cheaper. He did OK though, he gets out with a bag of cash and leaves someone else carrying the debt.
Re: WeWork Needed a Bailout, But Adam Neumann Still Leaves a Billionaire
#36[flagged]
I wonder how capitalism could compare with something like market socialism in cases like this. It seems like it would be easier for employees of companies (and stakeholders outside the company) to have more control over the direction of a business since they would also be shareholders. Adam Neumann types probably wouldn't be able to exist since they are so destructive to corporation and the people depending on the co…
Would market socialism have the possibility for massive financial gain by making the company IPO with as high a valuation as possible? In the end, it's that goal which caused all this. Employees had stock options probably and bought into that goal as much as anyone else. Remove the massive potential payout and everything calms down irrespective of economic system.
Re: WeWork Needed a Bailout, But Adam Neumann Still Leaves a Billionaire
#37As Matt Levine said, if you owe the bank a million dollars, you have a problem. If you owe the bank 100 million dollars, the bank has a problem.
I don't know who said that first but it certainly wasn't Matt Levine.
right, should have said "has oft quoted". Thanks for the correction.
Re: WeWork Needed a Bailout, But Adam Neumann Still Leaves a Billionaire
#38Earlier quoted context omitted.
Especially for companies that aren’t public yet so there’s no guarantee that you’ll be able to exercise ever, even if it does become profitable and worth real money.
What prevents you from exercising options in the success case? You might not be able to sell the shares you receive, but you should be able to exercise and hold them. You might do this to manage tax exposure (to get the clock started on long term capital gains treatment and to make further gains capital rather than earned income).
Nothing prevents you, but keep in mind options are an option to buy at a strike price that is generally non-trivial. By exercising early you're basically doubling down.
Re: WeWork Needed a Bailout, But Adam Neumann Still Leaves a Billionaire
#39Re: WeWork Needed a Bailout, But Adam Neumann Still Leaves a Billionaire
#40How do you get around the paywall? The usual tricks don't work... Besides paying money.