Estonia is running its country like a tech company • Hacker News Board

Re: Estonia is running its country like a tech company

#31

Post by atlasunshrugged » Tue, Oct 22, 2019, 8:58 AM UTC

pavlov wrote: post #23

If you're thinking about starting a company in Estonia under the "e-residency" program, you should know that Estonian banks have recently become very skeptical about opening bank accounts for foreigners. It's not enough that you have an Estonian corporation, you'll probably be expected to demonstrate that your business has actual ties to Estonia. Finnish entrepreneurs are being denied bank accounts despite the close…

Unfortunately, it isn't a new issue, I left the e-residency programme soon after the banking scandal (unrelated to why I left) but bank accounts have always been a major problem, especially because most of the business banking sector in Estonia is run by foreign firms with local branches rather than Estonian banks.

Re: Estonia is running its country like a tech company

#32

Post by anilakar » Tue, Oct 22, 2019, 9:00 AM UTC

atlasunshrugged wrote: post #16

I had a chance to work for the Estonian government for a brief while (headed up business development for e-Residency). While a few things may be overblown about their e-gov initiatives (I'm thinking some of the blockchain hype that foreign journalists didn't really fact check) they really have done an incredible job making their business environment accessible for foreigners. There really is a strong mentality of del…

Germany and Estonia have two completely opposing views when it comes to personal information, and the Estonian way is the way to success.

OTOH, the issue with USA is the conflict of interest between the public and private sector. Turbotax is a prime example.

Re: Estonia is running its country like a tech company

#33

Post by sbmthakur » Tue, Oct 22, 2019, 9:02 AM UTC

thrwoew4324 wrote: post #17

Taking the govt. services online is generally a good idea, but there are a lot of minefields along the way and is inherently tied to the country in question. I can only speak from the context of India where many things have indeed moved online, but are not exactly accessible. For one thing, they are essentially restricted to a small class of English speakers - which is expected since the English-speaking elite have a…

You are forgetting that Estonia comes nowhere close to India in terms of population and literacy. India is now estimated to have 125 million(and increasing) English speakers. Not sure if all of them are part of "elite" that you're talking about.

Re: Estonia is running its country like a tech company

#34

Post by pavlov » Tue, Oct 22, 2019, 9:03 AM UTC

atlasunshrugged wrote: post #31

pavlov wrote: post #23

If you're thinking about starting a company in Estonia under the "e-residency" program, you should know that Estonian banks have recently become very skeptical about opening bank accounts for foreigners. It's not enough that you have an Estonian corporation, you'll probably be expected to demonstrate that your business has actual ties to Estonia. Finnish entrepreneurs are being denied bank accounts despite the close…

Unfortunately, it isn't a new issue, I left the e-residency programme soon after the banking scandal (unrelated to why I left) but bank accounts have always been a major problem, especially because most of the business banking sector in Estonia is run by foreign firms with local branches rather than Estonian banks.

Startup idea: Create the globalized equivalent of Silicon Valley Bank in Estonia — a local bank that serves credible startups around the world, with staff that has the competence to evaluate customers’ tech chops.

Re: Estonia is running its country like a tech company

#35

Post by austhrow743 » Tue, Oct 22, 2019, 9:04 AM UTC

znq wrote: post #4

I've run and invested in businesses in multiple countries (Spain, Germany, US, UAE, Sri Lanka). One of them (Mobile Jazz - a fully remote company) we've moved to Estonia in 2016. One of the best business decisions we've made admin-wise. While there are for sure better alternatives when it comes to "saving on taxes" (I'd say Estonia is in the European average with 20% corporate tax and an interesting taxation model on…

Did you/people internal to your company set that up or did you use some agency that specialises in incorporating businesses in Estonia?

Re: Estonia is running its country like a tech company

#36

Post by mikorym » Tue, Oct 22, 2019, 9:04 AM UTC

romanovcode wrote: post #22

theredbox wrote: post #11

A lot is said about Estonia but Lithuania is better positioned and grows faster than Estonia. It's interesting but to me Estonia cant quite compete with its neighbors to the point of becoming wealthier than they are now.

I think this competitevness is stupid and Baltic countries should stand together because of so much history.

Same story in Southern Africa (although one couldn't say because of competition). The whole of Southern Africa should be a free trade zone, but isolationist behaviour takes place because of other factors, like for example xenophobia or in the case of Botswana, being pissed off by our (South African) instability vs. their more stable country.

Re: Estonia is running its country like a tech company

#37

Post by ex3ndr » Tue, Oct 22, 2019, 9:11 AM UTC

pavlov wrote: post #34

atlasunshrugged wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unfortunately, it isn't a new issue, I left the e-residency programme soon after the banking scandal (unrelated to why I left) but bank accounts have always been a major problem, especially because most of the business banking sector in Estonia is run by foreign firms with local branches rather than Estonian banks.

Startup idea: Create the globalized equivalent of Silicon Valley Bank in Estonia — a local bank that serves credible startups around the world, with staff that has the competence to evaluate customers’ tech chops.

Literally any creepy bank will be better than SVB, no?

Re: Estonia is running its country like a tech company

#38

Post by PopeDotNinja » Tue, Oct 22, 2019, 9:12 AM UTC

anilakar wrote: post #26

Rememeber: We're talking about a country that had to be bootstrapped after the fall of Soviet Union. They have had very little legacy (as in "old but not old enough to warrant a replacement") tech and legislation to deal with. My personal favorite is their wireless PSTN: Take existing NMT technology and give people tabletop terminals that will accommodate ordinary analog phones.

I had a friend working in Indonesia in the 90s, on Sumbawa. He mentioned how the locals had DVD players, but they had skipped ever having VCRs. I wonder what it looks for them now. Are they all on streaming services, or do they still use 90s era DVD players. I wonder what Estonia will look like in 20 years.

Re: Estonia is running its country like a tech company

#39

Post by dasanman » Tue, Oct 22, 2019, 9:14 AM UTC

znq wrote: post #4

I've run and invested in businesses in multiple countries (Spain, Germany, US, UAE, Sri Lanka). One of them (Mobile Jazz - a fully remote company) we've moved to Estonia in 2016. One of the best business decisions we've made admin-wise. While there are for sure better alternatives when it comes to "saving on taxes" (I'd say Estonia is in the European average with 20% corporate tax and an interesting taxation model on…

Hey, cool company!

Re: Estonia is running its country like a tech company

#40

Post by jaclaz » Tue, Oct 22, 2019, 9:15 AM UTC

dna_polymerase wrote: post #21

jaclaz wrote: post #9

I find more intriguing/interesting than the whole actual Estonian e-id/whatever technological achievements, that the President of a country writes an article (of course not very critical on the way the governement administration is managed) on qz.com.

See also, Erdogan on WSJ: https://www.wsj.com/articles/turkey-is-stepping-up-where-oth...

Yep, though I wouldn't personally put the Wall Street Journal on the same level as qz.

That they (WSJ) published Erdogan's piece is (to me) perplexing, but for completely different reasons.

This one on qz.com seems, at least to me, nothing different from the several "puff" articles we have read in the last few years about the digital "revolution" in Estonia (and e-residency, etc.), but till now they were all or almost all by either enthusiasts/futurists/thintankers or by people directly or indirectly involved in the program at a much lower level than the President.

Personally I always had the feeling that these pieces are not entirely unlike the good ol' gnome business plan:

1) get digital in Estonia (id, residency, etc.)

2) ?

3) profit

No doubts that there may be a number of non-Estonians that may benefit from the one or the other provisions of the program, but all in all they should be a niche of "digital nomads" and/or "digital only" very small firms.