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Thomas Cook collapses, stranding 150k UK holidaymakers

theguardian.com

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Re: Thomas Cook collapses, stranding 150k UK holidaymakers

#31

Post by rlucas »

PhilWright wrote: post #26

Why do these travel companies always go bust in a way that leaves people stranded? Surely the management must have known a week or two ago that the company was about to go under. In that case, stop anyone flying out but still bring people back. By the time they actually cease trading there should be few people left abroad. Some managers in Thomas Cook must have known that people flying out were going to end up strand…

The moment they stop accepting reservations for new travel outbound is the moment they are commercially dead.

Agreed, if you knew there was 0% hope (say, of flying anyone back a week hence) it would be unethical to keep it going. But if you were trying to keep things afloat and thought you could do, it would be unethical to do otherwise, since stopping new outbounds would 100% doom the firm and strand the overseas travelers.

Re: Thomas Cook collapses, stranding 150k UK holidaymakers

#32

Post by [deleted] »

PhilWright wrote: post #26

Why do these travel companies always go bust in a way that leaves people stranded? Surely the management must have known a week or two ago that the company was about to go under. In that case, stop anyone flying out but still bring people back. By the time they actually cease trading there should be few people left abroad. Some managers in Thomas Cook must have known that people flying out were going to end up strand…

[deleted]

Re: Thomas Cook collapses, stranding 150k UK holidaymakers

#33

Post by human20190310 »

greglindahl wrote: post #29
PhilWright wrote: post #26

Why do these travel companies always go bust in a way that leaves people stranded? Surely the management must have known a week or two ago that the company was about to go under. In that case, stop anyone flying out but still bring people back. By the time they actually cease trading there should be few people left abroad. Some managers in Thomas Cook must have known that people flying out were going to end up strand…

I'm sure you read the article, which mentions that there were negotiations up to the last minute to raise the last 200mm pounds on top of the 900mm pounds existing rescue package.

In general I think companies have a duty to their shareholders to fight to stay in business until it's literally impossible to do so. As long as there are resources left, those would have to be allocated to preserving the business, rather than to smoothing the process for their customers.

Re: Thomas Cook collapses, stranding 150k UK holidaymakers

#34

Post by PhilWright »

greglindahl wrote: post #29
PhilWright wrote: post #26

Why do these travel companies always go bust in a way that leaves people stranded? Surely the management must have known a week or two ago that the company was about to go under. In that case, stop anyone flying out but still bring people back. By the time they actually cease trading there should be few people left abroad. Some managers in Thomas Cook must have known that people flying out were going to end up strand…

I'm sure you read the article, which mentions that there were negotiations up to the last minute to raise the last 200mm pounds on top of the 900mm pounds existing rescue package.

Exactly, they should have stopped flying people out when they were within two weeks of closing. If they had secured the funding needed to continue then all well and good and then start flying people out again.

Re: Thomas Cook collapses, stranding 150k UK holidaymakers

#35

Post by maxden »

parsimo2010 wrote: post #11
CaliforniaKarl wrote: post #7

I don't think "stranding" is the right word. For some time now, UK companies selling "package holidays" (with hotel, air, etc. all from one vendor and with one bill) are required to put up funds that the government uses to repatriate those who are already traveling when a company goes under: https://www.caa.co.uk/atol-protection/ Note that it does not cover trips that people put together themselves; in that case, I e…

“Temporarily stuck until they can get a flight scheduled” is better, but wordy. These vacationers are in safe countries with good infrastructure. They definitely aren’t stranded like Tom Hanks in Cast Away. However, the other airlines can’t magic up 150,000 seats, so it might mean that some people will take a while to get home.

In one of the articles it said one hotel wasn't letting guests leave without paying more money, as the hotel believed they weren't going to get paid. So in some extreme cases it's not just about getting flights back to the UK.

Re: Thomas Cook collapses, stranding 150k UK holidaymakers

#36

Post by msclrhd »

greglindahl wrote: post #25

One interesting part of the news coverage is that there are 600k customers involved, and only 150k of them are UK holidaymakers. Notice the lack of coverage of the other 450k?

From the 05:37 summary:

-----

* There are 600,000 Thomas Cook travellers who have been left stuck overseas.

* More than 150,000 of those are Britons.

-----

Re: Thomas Cook collapses, stranding 150k UK holidaymakers

#37

Post by irjustin »

PhilWright wrote: post #34
greglindahl wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm sure you read the article, which mentions that there were negotiations up to the last minute to raise the last 200mm pounds on top of the 900mm pounds existing rescue package.

Exactly, they should have stopped flying people out when they were within two weeks of closing. If they had secured the funding needed to continue then all well and good and then start flying people out again.

I think there's a catch 22 here.

The instant the airline says "We're no longer accepting bookings because we're working to figure out a cash situation." you've got to believe everyone else who is still booked will pull their ticket for a refund of any form. I would be.

There would be a massive outflow of what little available cash exists.

The announcement whether early or late is the immediate death knell of the company.

I do agree at face value this seems terrible, but I honestly don't see a better course of action given they were waiting for a bailout and then didn't receive it.

Re: Thomas Cook collapses, stranding 150k UK holidaymakers

#39

Post by xioxox »

HenryBemis wrote: post #8

I was always wondering about the profit margins of these companies. From their prices I always felt that I am paying a portion of the previous guy's vacations. I'd call it a pyramid scheme, only everybody loses.

The big problem was its £1.4bn in debt, which really brought it down. Id be careful holding shares in companies with big debt if there's a coming downturn.

Re: Thomas Cook collapses, stranding 150k UK holidaymakers

#40

Post by stordoff »

CaliforniaKarl wrote: post #14
parsimo2010 wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

“Temporarily stuck until they can get a flight scheduled” is better, but wordy. These vacationers are in safe countries with good infrastructure. They definitely aren’t stranded like Tom Hanks in Cast Away. However, the other airlines can’t magic up 150,000 seats, so it might mean that some people will take a while to get home.

Thomas Cook was more than just a travel agent. They were also an airline… https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Cook_Airlines … and a hotel chain … https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Cook_Hotels_&_Resorts I would not be surprised if the UK has laws in place, and/or are using ATOL funds, so that the existing Thomas Cook aircraft can be pressed into service for the return journeys. For example, return arrangements hav…

> The return flight details are identical to the original Thomas Cook flights (other than the flight numbers, which are similar).

I suspect it's different operators re-using the same flight numbers and airport slots.

ZT is Titan (a short notice lease provider, which makes sense): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Titan_Airways

U2 is easyJet: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EasyJet

Titan Airways are confirmed as providing support:

> Following the collapse of Thomas Cook, Titan Airways are working in co-ordination with the Civil Aviation Authority to provide return flights back to the UK for those passengers currently overseas.

http://www.titan-airways.com/

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