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Death Of The Mouse?

appdeveloper.intel.com

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Re: Death Of The Mouse?

#31

Post by julian37 »

Derbasti wrote: post #22
julian37 wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is not entirely true. Our head isn't mounted on our torso, it's mounted on our neck which can swivel! That's why you don't have to hold a book or your mobile phone or tablet at eye level. Also, many marvelous masterpieces have been created by painters working with an easel, where the requirement of having to lift their arms doesn't seem to have been too much of a distraction. If you really want to interact with…

True indeed. But painting involves steady motion of the hand whereas interaction with computers requires much less motion and thus is far more straining for our arms. Basically, it all revolves around strain: We don't want to strain our arms by holding something up in the air for a long time and we don't want to strain out neck by holding the head in an imbalanced position for a long time. As long as the head can sit…

Point taken, but I think there's a difference between casual and professional, extended use. For casual use I can see touch taking over more and more, and for professional use - such as for graphic designers or compositors - the mouse isn't always the best input device to begin with.

Re: Death Of The Mouse?

#32

Post by vacri »

julian37 wrote: post #17
Derbasti wrote: post #3

Since our eyes are built into the front plate of our head and our head is mounted upright on our torso, displays are bound to stand vertically in front of our eyes. Hands are pretty bad at interacting with vertical surfaces as this requires us to lift both hands and arms for prolonged periods of time. Hence, there has to be a horizontal, desktop-surface that we manually interact with and a vertical surface that we lo…

That is not entirely true. Our head isn't mounted on our torso, it's mounted on our neck which can swivel! That's why you don't have to hold a book or your mobile phone or tablet at eye level. Also, many marvelous masterpieces have been created by painters working with an easel, where the requirement of having to lift their arms doesn't seem to have been too much of a distraction. If you really want to interact with…

"That's why you don't have to hold a book or your mobile phone or tablet at eye level."

Bad ergonomics though. I actually got what I call a reading injury. 45 minute walk to work gets boring after a while, and after getting tinnitus (which when it was bad is /really/ bad) I was paranoid about listening to music or podcasts. So I read a book on my walk. Walking plus reading = bad for your neck. Took a couple of weeks of not read-walking to get my neck back to not hurting.

That's an extreme example though. However, even in simpler terms, your neck is not made to be held at an angle for extended times. When you curl up on the couch with a book, you'll usually have good support. Do that same angle in an office chair 40 hours a week and you'll start running into problems.

Re: Death Of The Mouse?

#33

Post by vacri »

loewenskind wrote: post #24

I would absolutely expect the death of the mouse. In its current form that is. In my opinion the mouse interface introduced with the MBP and now purchasable as an external component is a sign of the future. It has the same precision as a regular mouse so you don't have the iPad's touch problem of lack of precision, but you move your finger on the device instead of moving the device. That alone wouldn't be enough to u…

That 'touchpad plate' of Apple's (can't recall the official name) isn't as precise as a mouse. Our web developer gets a new box from Foxconn about once a week as he pretty much buys one of everything Apple makes. A true afficionado of the touchscreen/pad, he just couldn't use that plate for the specific reason that it's just not accurate enough for serious work. Touch and mouse focus on different things - and the mouse is venerable, not vulnerable :)

Re: Death Of The Mouse?

#34

Post by drtse4 »

potatolicious wrote: post #18

Touch killing the mouse makes about as much sense as helicopters killing airplanes.

Yes, even in 2011 i still don't see anything that could really substitute the mouse on desktops or laptops. Every alternative is a pain to use (e.g. touchpads).

Re: Death Of The Mouse?

#35

Post by vacri »

moultano wrote: post #9
stratjakt wrote: post #2

Microsoft presented their new touch mouse at CES. Yeah, mice are definitely not new and exciting at this point, but until 'touch' becomes ubiquitous they are still quite necessary. Since I still have to live with mice for the foreseeable future, I'm frustrated at the lack of decent wired mice on the market. Wireless mice always give me tracking issues and I don't like the inconvenience of replacing batteries. But eve…

I absolutely swear by evoluent mice: http://www.evoluent.com/ Your forearm is in a much more natural position, and the hard part of it is exposed to the table edge or pad, not the soft part.

They look very friendly to "full-hand" mousers, but a little unfriendly to "finger" mousers. Do you finger-mouse? How do you find it?

EDIT: It's obvious how you find it, you said it directly. Change the question to "do you finger-mouse?" :)

Re: Death Of The Mouse?

#36

Post by vacri »

pkamb wrote: post #12

I'd normally say a resounding "no" for the reasons everyone else is stating: fat finger problem, pixel-perfect precision, arm strain of pointing at a screen, etc. However, for the last year or so I've exclusively used the Trackpoint on my Thinkpad. Amazing little gizmo. Almost the same precision as a mouse, three buttons to click with, and it keeps your hands in the touch-typing position at all times. I was experienc…

Big fan of the trackpoint. I hate trackpads, they're always clumsy (though multitouch was a great advancement) but the trackpoint is precise and doesn't easily 'drop' things when you're dragging. Nothing like that trackpad moment when the item you're dragging doesn't quite reach the destination before you hit the side of the pad :)

Found the trackpoint hard to learn though - there's a lot of subtle muscle control. Steep curve, but rewarding once you have it.

Re: Death Of The Mouse?

#37

Post by alextp »

drtse4 wrote: post #34
potatolicious wrote: post #18

Touch killing the mouse makes about as much sense as helicopters killing airplanes.

Yes, even in 2011 i still don't see anything that could really substitute the mouse on desktops or laptops. Every alternative is a pain to use (e.g. touchpads).

Actually, as far as pain goes, my hand hurts a lot sooner with a mouse than with my laptop's touchpad. The touchpad makes it easier to (1) switch between the right and left hands to move the pointer around and (2) move the pointer around without moving my wrists from the keyboard, and both these things really improve computer usage long term for me.

I haven't used a mouse in years.

Re: Death Of The Mouse?

#38

Post by bad_user »

By mouse I understand the ability to move the mouse pointer and left/right click.

At a conference it's better to go light, just with your laptop/netbook, carrying a real mouse around doesn't make sense, but when standing in front of a computer at work or home for several hours a real mouse is still more comfortable/ergonomic than a touchpad, although I do find the touchpad more comfortable in situations where I do lots of typing, since it's closer to the keyboard.

I get the trend of smaller / lighter / more portable ... I haven't used a desktop in 2 years. But I still use a good keyboard and mouse when I'm at my desk; anything less is just for superficial usage.

Re: Death Of The Mouse?

#39

Post by chaostheory »

drtse4 wrote: post #34
potatolicious wrote: post #18

Touch killing the mouse makes about as much sense as helicopters killing airplanes.

Yes, even in 2011 i still don't see anything that could really substitute the mouse on desktops or laptops. Every alternative is a pain to use (e.g. touchpads).

I actually work faster using a [touchpad + keyboard] vs [mouse + keyboard]. The trick is placement. The touchpad needs to be right below the keyboard (like a macbook layout) so you can switch faster between typing and moving the cursor as opposed to using a mouse. If your OS / trackpad supports gestures, that increases speed of use as well.

For comfort, imo the whole thing needs to be lower, closer to your legs. If you're using a standing position instead of sitting, just change the position to closer to your thighs.

Re: Death Of The Mouse?

#40

Post by bobds »

chaostheory wrote: post #39
drtse4 wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, even in 2011 i still don't see anything that could really substitute the mouse on desktops or laptops. Every alternative is a pain to use (e.g. touchpads).

I actually work faster using a [touchpad + keyboard] vs [mouse + keyboard]. The trick is placement. The touchpad needs to be right below the keyboard (like a macbook layout) so you can switch faster between typing and moving the cursor as opposed to using a mouse. If your OS / trackpad supports gestures, that increases speed of use as well. For comfort, imo the whole thing needs to be lower, closer to your legs. If y…

My wireless mouse is usually in front of my keyboard, ending up between my arms while I'm typing.
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