Why I Turned Down an AWS Job Offer • Hacker News Board

Re: Why I Turned Down an AWS Job Offer

#31

Post by algaeontoast » Mon, Aug 05, 2019, 4:08 PM UTC

Working for amazon is like joining a fascist cult - you made the right decision.

Source - worked for a startup that was acquired by Amazon. My team was slowly managed out of the company and replaced by teams in Seattle. Most of my team was let go by PIP, essentially claiming we weren't "performing at a high enough standard" since they weren't willing to reprehend my boss for being incompetent.

However, I'm proud of the fact that in my exit interview my incompetent boss tried to have me give a "reason for my willful exit" to which I responded "oranges". I mostly did this because there was an Amazon HR person on Chime (internal Amazon Skype) during the meeting recording a transcript of the meeting. So at some point, my boss had to explain to her boss why she fired someone and explain why my reason was "oranges".

TLDR: Amazon is cheap, doesn't care about workers and is kind of horrible.

Re: Why I Turned Down an AWS Job Offer

#32

Post by algaeontoast » Mon, Aug 05, 2019, 4:10 PM UTC

ses1984 wrote: post #10

dvt wrote: post #5

I've also turned down countless Amazon interview offers. In fact, I don't get how I'm still on their recruitment lists after asking several times to be removed. Amazon has arguably the worst culture out of any large tech company, and generally treats its workers like dirt. Given all my friends that worked for them, almost all have quit within 5 years. Given their abysmal warehouse management, it's no surprise they ha…

How many friends do you have who worked for a company more than 5 years? Work for Amazon for 2 years, learn a lot, get paid a lot, move on.

Amazon benefits are shit and you generally can't negotiate a raise within 2 years. Generally, you're not really off the chopping block until you're an SDEIII or entered as an SDEIII and performed "above the bar" for at least 1.5 years or a requisite number of quarterly reviews.

Re: Why I Turned Down an AWS Job Offer

#33

Post by _q1cj » Mon, Aug 05, 2019, 4:10 PM UTC

SteveNuts wrote: post #16

Every time I've talked to AWS Recruiters they've belittled by past experience and just generally made me feel bad about my career. I will never ever work there, no matter how cool their tech stack must be.

I can tell you from experience, the internal Amazon stack is not cool or inventive.

Re: Why I Turned Down an AWS Job Offer

#34

Post by zeropnc » Mon, Aug 05, 2019, 4:12 PM UTC

dvt wrote: post #5

I've also turned down countless Amazon interview offers. In fact, I don't get how I'm still on their recruitment lists after asking several times to be removed. Amazon has arguably the worst culture out of any large tech company, and generally treats its workers like dirt. Given all my friends that worked for them, almost all have quit within 5 years. Given their abysmal warehouse management, it's no surprise they ha…

It treats its white collar workers like adults, not privileged overly sensitive babies. Only in the Silicon Valley is that considered “dirt”.

Re: Why I Turned Down an AWS Job Offer

#35

Post by awinder » Mon, Aug 05, 2019, 4:15 PM UTC

Naac wrote: post #8

Amazon is not the only company to sue over this, Microsoft successfully sued as well[0]. In fact, several large companies have pushed to keep these non-competes in place in Washington State[1]. I don't think it's fair to focus only on Amazon. The reality is that in Washington State, this benefits many large corporations ( while being harmful to employees ) so it is the company's incentive to try and keep the non-comp…

Applying a noncompete to sales (as in the parent article) or as jimmy johns has done is pretty beyond the pale. I don’t like noncompetes and think they’re hostile but someone at corporate officer level having it enforced is a different world.

Re: Why I Turned Down an AWS Job Offer

#36

Post by Spooky23 » Mon, Aug 05, 2019, 4:15 PM UTC

daenz wrote: post #4

How does refusing to sign a non-compete clause typically play out? I imagine it goes back and forth, and I'm trying to imagine a tactful way to do it that doesn't burn the relationship.

Depends. If it's a big company with centralized administration, it's not going to happen. With a smaller company, a less assholey company or a somewhat independent division of a bigger company it's possible.

Re: Why I Turned Down an AWS Job Offer

#37

Post by GoodJokes » Mon, Aug 05, 2019, 4:18 PM UTC

rectang wrote: post #14

> Come on, AWS. Do better than this. The advantages are too significant. If a company of sufficient size isn't doing this, they're doing something else. Statistically, employees cannot win; there may be outliers where an employee prevails, but in the aggregate, the company will win — and that makes these draconian policies worthwhile. Companies enjoy economies of scale when it comes to negotiating employment, because…

There is also a thing called unions.

Re: Why I Turned Down an AWS Job Offer

#38

Post by mrep » Mon, Aug 05, 2019, 4:18 PM UTC

philsnow wrote: post #20

ses1984 wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How many friends do you have who worked for a company more than 5 years? Work for Amazon for 2 years, learn a lot, get paid a lot, move on.

Except the vast majority of your equity award, which itself makes up the vast majority of your total compensation at Amazon as an engineer, vests in your third and fourth years. Your first and second years you vest 5% and 15% (reportedly).

You get cash bonuses the first two years to make up for that so your total comp doesn't actually change that much.

Re: Why I Turned Down an AWS Job Offer

#39

Post by abj » Mon, Aug 05, 2019, 4:19 PM UTC

> We need this to protect our business.

> It’s never enforced.

If these are true, why would a company with 232.9 billion in revenue be afraid of paying an employee's salary only when the non compete is enforced?

If the non compete is almost never enforced this agreement would cost the company under 0.01% of total company wide employee spend. Surely if the knowledge was that important to the business the company would easily make up the "extra" salary paid in revenue.

It's strange that a company that large wouldn't agree to pay salary if it's chosing to enforce the non-compete. It seems like the choice is motivated by something else than reason. Tradition? Optimizing locally for cost reduction?

Re: Why I Turned Down an AWS Job Offer

#40

Post by sokoloff » Mon, Aug 05, 2019, 4:21 PM UTC

rectang wrote: post #14

> Come on, AWS. Do better than this. The advantages are too significant. If a company of sufficient size isn't doing this, they're doing something else. Statistically, employees cannot win; there may be outliers where an employee prevails, but in the aggregate, the company will win — and that makes these draconian policies worthwhile. Companies enjoy economies of scale when it comes to negotiating employment, because…

A sane company will only employ workers to the extent it’s advantageous for them.

For that reason, I think it’s wise to go cautiously when making it less advantageous for companies to hire. Much of that ends up being taken out of labor rather than companies.