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Kept alive with tubes for nearly 17 years

latimes.com

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Re: Kept alive with tubes for nearly 17 years

#31

Post by D_Alex »

sysbin wrote: post #28

Insane! Stories like this one make me question if it should be a requirement for every person to have on file his/her AMD for situations related to this outcome. People shouldn’t fear death or existence may be an extreme prison of torture. Why people continue to allow this is beyond me. Heck only till recently in all of humankind has this kind of torture become a thing. Geese..

>Why people continue to allow this is beyond me.

If, in the end, the patient recovers, what a happy ending that would be! And we might learn how to better assist others in this condition.

The alternative is giving up forever on such cases. This is also partly why I lean "against" on euthanasia.

Re: Kept alive with tubes for nearly 17 years

#32

Post by neuronic »

baddox wrote: post #9
jimmaswell wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Learn morse code so you can communicate with any action you can do, like in Johnny Got His Gun (the basis for One by Metallica)

That only works if anyone is “listening.”

How many weeks of entertainment will it provide when you are trying to make people notice that your left blinking eye is morse code?

Re: Kept alive with tubes for nearly 17 years

#34

Post by kiba »

chillfox wrote: post #19
asdfasgasdgasdg wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hard for me to imagine wanting this life. Imprisoned in a state worse than solitary confinement for more than a decade. Life is very good, most of the time, but there are states where less is more.

That really depends upon how bright you think the future is. If you think the future will bring amazing medical breakthroughs and immortality, then tubes is only temporary and all you gotta do is hang on long enough.

The problem seems to me is hanging on long enough to reach the future.

Re: Kept alive with tubes for nearly 17 years

#35

Post by Benjamin_Dobell »

chillfox wrote: post #19
asdfasgasdgasdg wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hard for me to imagine wanting this life. Imprisoned in a state worse than solitary confinement for more than a decade. Life is very good, most of the time, but there are states where less is more.

That really depends upon how bright you think the future is. If you think the future will bring amazing medical breakthroughs and immortality, then tubes is only temporary and all you gotta do is hang on long enough.

Even if immortality were to become reality, what incentive could there be to cure the ill?

Perhaps I'm just unimaginative, however I can't really fathom a world in which it would make economical sense to cure the ill rather than simply prevent people getting sick. Economically those with illnesses and/or genetic conditions (myself included) unfortunately seem like a bit of a lost cause.

Re: Kept alive with tubes for nearly 17 years

#36

Post by collyw »

erikpukinskis wrote: post #5
hestipod wrote: post #4

This has to be a "worst nightmare" for most people. I came across a guy a very long time ago who had been in a long term care unit after an auto accident for something like 15 years at that point. The story I was told, and I don't know it's veracity, is that he was resuscitated against his stated wishes and the hospital was paying for his care forever. His eyes would open but he didn't respond in any way to any stimu…

I suspect after enough months of no stimulus you just go unconscious. Your brain learns to be conscious why wouldn’t your brain learn not to be. It’s normal mode is to stop caring about noise.

Sensory deprivation tanks would suggest the opposite happens - they are supposed to be similar to the psychedelic experience.

Re: Kept alive with tubes for nearly 17 years

#37

Post by pantalaimon »

chillfox wrote: post #19
asdfasgasdgasdg wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hard for me to imagine wanting this life. Imprisoned in a state worse than solitary confinement for more than a decade. Life is very good, most of the time, but there are states where less is more.

That really depends upon how bright you think the future is. If you think the future will bring amazing medical breakthroughs and immortality, then tubes is only temporary and all you gotta do is hang on long enough.

But what if your brain is so damaged, there isn't much left of 'you'?

And until then your whole existence would be confined to perpetual pain. This is the stuff of nightmares.

Re: Kept alive with tubes for nearly 17 years

#38

Post by waterhouse »

Benjamin_Dobell wrote: post #35
chillfox wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That really depends upon how bright you think the future is. If you think the future will bring amazing medical breakthroughs and immortality, then tubes is only temporary and all you gotta do is hang on long enough.

Even if immortality were to become reality, what incentive could there be to cure the ill? Perhaps I'm just unimaginative, however I can't really fathom a world in which it would make economical sense to cure the ill rather than simply prevent people getting sick. Economically those with illnesses and/or genetic conditions (myself included) unfortunately seem like a bit of a lost cause.

Surely restoring a skilled 58-year-old with decades of experience to full health is much faster and cheaper than making an entirely new human and training them to the same level.

As for preventing people getting sick—well, from what I've heard, a significant reason older people are more likely to get cancer is that their immune system and their body's ability to repair itself are weaker (and one part of cancer is DNA damage), so it seems like the most likely approaches to preventing cancer are also going to help with curing other illnesses.

Re: Kept alive with tubes for nearly 17 years

#39

Post by coldtea »

chillfox wrote: post #19
asdfasgasdgasdg wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hard for me to imagine wanting this life. Imprisoned in a state worse than solitary confinement for more than a decade. Life is very good, most of the time, but there are states where less is more.

That really depends upon how bright you think the future is. If you think the future will bring amazing medical breakthroughs and immortality, then tubes is only temporary and all you gotta do is hang on long enough.

>If you think the future will bring amazing medical breakthroughs and immortality, then tubes is only temporary and all you gotta do is hang on long enough.

I'd say don't bet on it.

The changes to life expectancy and quality of life from early low hanging fruits (most of which weren't even that advanced, like clean water, washing hands for surgeries, basic antibiotics, etc.) dwarf later developments such as heart surgery, bionic limbs, and advanced drugs (aside a few important breakthroughs for people affected with specific conditions).

A more realistic outlook is whether you think you might eventually get out of the coma -- which does happen.

Re: Kept alive with tubes for nearly 17 years

#40

Post by scotty79 »

nonbel wrote: post #24
adrianN wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can imagine that there are legitimate reasons not to use anesthesia on babies who show no signs of remembering the pain when they've become able to communicate. Anesthesia is not without risk, probably doubly so for a developing brain.

So? Does that mean babies don't feel pain? Because that is what the medical profession concluded. Here is a good overview: http://nocirc.org/symposia/second/chamberlain.html

You are in an accident and have to be operated on, but using anesthesia would drop probability of survival from 90% to 10%. They can give you instead a drug that will prevent you from remembering pain that has no influence on probability of success operation.

What would you chose?

I'm not saying that this is the exact case with infants. Just trying to illustrate there might be valid reasons to inflict temporary pain to save health.

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