31–40 of 68 posts
It seems to me that CloudFlare should just sponsor servers for inclusion in the long-standing global NTP pools. https://www.ntppool.org/en/
pool.ntp.org is a open source project (under Apache License) with a open group of contributors (volunteers). Basically the opposite of what Cloudflare is and stands for. Sponsoring servers in pool.ntp.org wouldn't support Cloudflare's goal(s).
I think it would be super interesting if they started offering IEEE 1588 v2 aka Precision Time Protocol, but it would be much harder to offer compared to ntp. What they're almost certainly doing here is just running a cable to the roof where they have a GPS antenna and then run it into their datacenters into a time appliance (less likely) or a GPS pci card in one of their servers (more likely) that they then send out…
You really can't do PTP over the internet, at least not meaningfully. Anyone who needs PTP is going to have their own grandmasters, reference sources, etc - and then a distribution network. Most telecoms applications use an ePRTC source which tends to be implemented as a GPS/GLONASS/Galileo redundant frequency source, plus a local rubidium source or cesium reference. High-end telecoms applications use a hydrogen mase…
That was my point. Also if you're inside one of Cloudflare's many POPs, this could, in theory, be provided.
So frustrated that Cloudflare didn't just add resources/support the existing NTP Pool. Hard to even pretend their motives are altruistic at this point.
Disgusting that supposed "hackers" and experts on hackernews advocate for single point of failures in the internet infrastructure. The internet is supposed to be distributed. If the NTP pool admins go nuts, have a fight etc, I'm glad there is an alternative. You can generally specify multiple sources, this would be a new source. And it's always the BS "they're evil" argument - when the posters contribute nothing them…
Earlier quoted context omitted.
What's your objection? It has 12 evenly distributed lines, which are commonly used to represent the numbers on an analog clock. It has an hour hand, a minute hand, and a second hand. The only thing I can see that seems even a little off is that the hour hand seems slightly past the 1 mark, whereas the minute hand being on ~54 suggests it might want to be slightly before. It seems very clock-like to me.. What gives yo…
Only looking at this because I saw this reply. I don't have a visceral reaction to it, but I do believe that the design of the clock is rather ambiguous. From my perspective, the minute hand is actually at ~24 hence the hour hand being a little past 1. Given that it's so easy to mix up (I had to stare at it to be sure), I'm guessing the parent commenter got frustrated with it. ️
Earlier quoted context omitted.
pool.ntp.org is a open source project (under Apache License) with a open group of contributors (volunteers). Basically the opposite of what Cloudflare is and stands for. Sponsoring servers in pool.ntp.org wouldn't support Cloudflare's goal(s).
Just wondering, do Apple or MSFT sponsor them? They also run their own respective NTP servers.
What Cloudflare offers the community is cool, but the world at large should be prepared for them to evaporate at any time (or, more likely, to be acquired by someone not as benevolent).
I'm a huge fan of Cloudflare in general, but sometimes I'm a bit uncomfortable with how much critical infrastructure is increasingly consolidated into a few single entities.
Are the local time servers stratum 1, or do they have some central stratum 1 source that they then distribute out to the edge datacenters? What's the value over just building your own stratum 1 source? (Shameless plug: https://github.com/jrockway/beaglebone-gps-clock/blob/master... )
Edit: dropped their address in my NTP config, and the Cloudflare server I got is a stratum 3. Don't see many of those about now, generally pool.ntp.org returns a mix of stratum 1 and 2 servers at least for the UK. Guess it's not too surprising if they're getting time from a handful of third-party stratum 1 servers and then distributing it to their edge nodes though.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
You really can't do PTP over the internet, at least not meaningfully. Anyone who needs PTP is going to have their own grandmasters, reference sources, etc - and then a distribution network. Most telecoms applications use an ePRTC source which tends to be implemented as a GPS/GLONASS/Galileo redundant frequency source, plus a local rubidium source or cesium reference. High-end telecoms applications use a hydrogen mase…
Yeah I agree, but ptpv2 does support unicast and you can set offsets. It would be very challenging, but not impossible sans the very high res stuff where you need oscillators on the switches and routers, as you alluded to. It wouldn't get down to the sub-10 nanosecond sync you get with a proper stratum 1 timesource (such as the rubidium decay ones), but you could get faster than the guaranteed 1 second of accuracy wh…
PTP does support unicast messaging, but it is not meant to be used as a public service. There are two major problems: It's not stateless and it has a huge traffic amplification, which could be easily exploited for DoS attacks.