Clearly a quest to reach "new audiences" but it gives me a good chuckle.
The preachers getting rich from poor Americans
31–40 of 58 posts
Re: The preachers getting rich from poor Americans
#32This isn't limited to the US either, City Harvest Church in Singapore is a great example of the prosperity gospel in action elsewhere. S$50 million (US$36m) of donations were siphoned from the church, of which half went into attempting to launch the pastor's wife into pop stardom, including this distinctly un-churchy video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wSZQH_c9jOU (Yes, that is Wyclef Jean; he was paid almost $2m…
Both Catholicism (even with the pope) and traditional Protestantism have mechanisms to resist this. Catholicism resists it because clericalism pushes back against cults of the person of the pope specifically (notice the incessant factional backstabbing), but also because the parish priest is more a functionary of rites than anything else--sermons in Catholic churches are generally brief. Protestant denominations like Presbyterianism, Methodism, and Lutheranism maintain (at least nominally) the Catholic tradition of apostolic succession and a system of Presbyters and Bishops, which diffuses theological power structurally. Notably Anabaptists and Pentecostalism discard these structures almost entirely, so no coincidence that they're more susceptible to cults of personalities.
I grew up Catholic in a small southern town. There was one Catholic church among dozens (if not a hundred plus) protestant churches; it was mostly attended by military families. I remember the parish priest (who was my confirmation sponsor as I had no family or close Catholic family friends to sponsor me) complaining that the community, including parishioners, gossiped that he wasn't godly enough. He drove around in a Cadillac and drank (moderately). What the community didn't know was that he was pretty much the only pastor who personally volunteered at local charities unaffiliated with our church, in addition to the work he did for the church's own programs. But he never made it a point to inform people of this because he did it on his personal time--just like he bought his Cadillac using his clerical stipend and drank on his own time. He refused to advertise this on principle. He railed against the cults of personality of local churchgoers (including his own parishioners) and of local churches. Their priorities were all screwed up. Since then American Catholicism specifically and Roman Catholicism globally has increasingly shifted in this troubling direction, in tandem with Christianity more generally.
Anyhow, to reiterate, it's not just a problem with Baptists or Pentecostalism, nor do all Baptist and Pentecostal churches suffer from the problem. But there's an interplay between doctrine and institutional structure. People will readily admit it when discussing how the Roman Catholic hierarchy protected child rapists; but they refuse to see the downsides to excessively decentralized institutions that put too much unchecked power and influence in the hands of local leaders.
The U.S. has exported the problem globally because it's exported the Charismatic Movement.
Re: The preachers getting rich from poor Americans
#33https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Popoff
>He went bankrupt the next year, but made a comeback in the late 1990s. Beginning in the mid-2000s, Popoff bought TV time to promote "Miracle Spring Water" on late-night infomercials, and referred to himself as a prophet.[2] Business Insider remarked, "No matter how many times his claims are debunked, he seems to bounce back with another version of the same old scam."[3]
>Popoff was collecting almost $4 million per year in the late 1980s, according to Randi.[41] In 2003, his ministry received over $9.6 million, and in 2005, over $23 million. In that year, he and his wife were paid a combined salary of nearly $1 million, while two of his children received over $180,000 each.[42] Financial data is not available for Popoff's ministry since 2005 because Peter Popoff Ministries changed from a for-profit business to a religious organization in 2006, making it tax-exempt.[40] Popoff purchased a home in Bradbury, California, for $4.5 million in 2007.[43] He drives a Porsche and a Mercedes-Benz.[44]
Re: The preachers getting rich from poor Americans
#34why is this in hn? if it is relevant, would hn link to articles on any selfless acts and charities by the religious(given that in reality hundreds of millions are helped by them)? seems there is an anti christian bias in this sort articles selected by hn; only the ones reflecting badly on christians are allowed.
Isn't it obvious? A lot of HN readers are interested in making money. This article shows one way to do it.
Combine prosperity gospel with MLM, buy some YouTube ads for the right demographics and in front of the right videos, and you've got yourself a nice self-growing tax sheltered business that is politically infeasible to regulate. It's not like Zuckerberg has any scruples either.
Re: The preachers getting rich from poor Americans
#35It is not just limited to US. You will be surprised how much of that money goes back to forced conversions in countries like India, Bangladesh, Sri Lanka etc. In India, the state of Nagaland has 90% christian population. They destroyed the local cultures and traditions.
The Naga were headhunters before converting to Christianity, National Geographic has a clip about it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oLs-UoqzLlU
Re: The preachers getting rich from poor Americans
#36Re: The preachers getting rich from poor Americans
#37This isn't limited to the US either, City Harvest Church in Singapore is a great example of the prosperity gospel in action elsewhere. S$50 million (US$36m) of donations were siphoned from the church, of which half went into attempting to launch the pastor's wife into pop stardom, including this distinctly un-churchy video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wSZQH_c9jOU (Yes, that is Wyclef Jean; he was paid almost $2m…
It's an issue with the Charismatic Movement, which is particularly strong among Evangelicalism but hardly limited to it. It promotes a cult of personality, or rather numerous cults of personality. Both Catholicism (even with the pope) and traditional Protestantism have mechanisms to resist this. Catholicism resists it because clericalism pushes back against cults of the person of the pope specifically (notice the inc…
Re: The preachers getting rich from poor Americans
#38Earlier quoted context omitted.
You assume that the whole stock market is a zero-sum game which is patently false. Businesses raise money , many if not all use this money to grow their businesses and return money to shareholders via dividends / buyback. Stock appreciation is a result of this activity. FYI , a dollar invested in S&P index in 1926 was worth 5000+ dollars in 2014 ( http://skloff.com/growth-of-1-dollar-investment-1926-2014/ ). If this…
1926 is an intriguing year to start if your goal is to mislead.
Re: The preachers getting rich from poor Americans
#39Earlier quoted context omitted.
Ha. I see what you're getting at. It's a little different because politicians actually do have the power to change things. Proof by existence: before there was no ACA, now there is an ACA. While being a member of a church can probably improve your life in some ways -- a built in community of like-minded people -- it won't directly fix your problems in a way that another community can't. And if you're not using church…
Are you saying that organized religion doesn't have the power to influence change? Politicians do not have a monopoly on impact, in fact, I would say that they have become quite inefficient at it.
Re: The preachers getting rich from poor Americans
#40Earlier quoted context omitted.
You assume that the whole stock market is a zero-sum game which is patently false. Businesses raise money , many if not all use this money to grow their businesses and return money to shareholders via dividends / buyback. Stock appreciation is a result of this activity. FYI , a dollar invested in S&P index in 1926 was worth 5000+ dollars in 2014 ( http://skloff.com/growth-of-1-dollar-investment-1926-2014/ ). If this…
There is a small army of portfolio managers that under perform index funds year after year. Like almost all of them. And investment banks both selling securities and betting against them at the same time. The non zero sum part is called the real economy. Which itself is under performing the market. Or the current crop of tech companies which exist solely to launder negative interest central bank credit.