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Why what we think we know about schizophrenia is wrong

theguardian.com

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Re: Why what we think we know about schizophrenia is wrong

#31

Post by asveikau »

asveikau wrote: post #12
coleifer wrote: post #8

My youngest brother has schizophrenia, which started when he was 19. He just turned 31, and were it not for his family supporting and caring for him, I'm sure he would be homeless or worse. He's one of the most sensitive, gentle people I have ever known. My wife and others who have gotten to know him would agree. Although he's "stable", thanks to an injection every 3 weeks, he's not going to ever get better. In fact…

It might be he doesn't want to associate with people, groups, events that revolve around the diagnosis. Perhaps that labels him an "other" and it feels little much. Why not similar activities with the general population? That is not meant to belittle the point that delusional people will strongly deny their symptoms, of course. Being close to somebody like that gets tough, especially when the delusions have led to ha…

Downvoters, I am curious what the objection is. If I may elaborate on the second paragraph, the situation I am describing is one where someone is harming themselves or others, but saying everything is fine and refusing treatment. Then they get treatment, they improve for a while, and maybe you see some behavior that reminds you of that earlier episode, but they insist they're fine again. So you might ask: is this a relapse into delusion? Or are they really fine? Honestly it is tough to answer. When you have seen their condition hurting people and being kind of dangerous, it's easy to get scared of misjudging that situation.

Re: Why what we think we know about schizophrenia is wrong

#32

Post by scardine »

flensortow wrote: post #18
jquery wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mostly agree, but I think the movie romanticized the end of institutionalization, making us believe we've progressed "beyond" it, when we merely have people screaming on street corners and sleeping in the gutter. Institutionalization should've been reformed, not all but eliminated (I know it still exists, but only for the most extreme cases).

If someone is not a threat to themselves or others, but has strange beliefs and behaviors, should we really take their freedom away just because we don’t think they are taking care of themselves adequately or we don’t like the sight/sound of them? As someone with bipolar disorder (very stable since diagnosis and medication) I’m always a bit dismayed when people call for locking ill people up “for their own good.” (No…

This. I'm fortunate enough to be considered only "eccentric" as most people are willing to forgive my weirdness in exchange for other useful personality traits. Not everybody is that lucky.

Re: Why what we think we know about schizophrenia is wrong

#33

Post by scardine »

jquery wrote: post #6
scardine wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think "one flew over the cuckoo's nest" romanticizes mental illness, for me it is about demonizing institutionalization. It pictures the time when mental illness diagnostic was an easy method to put away anyone annoying or inconvenient (the subject really having a mental illness or not made little difference). It talks about institutional cruelty like torture and lobotomy. But then I didn't read the book, jus…

I mostly agree, but I think the movie romanticized the end of institutionalization, making us believe we've progressed "beyond" it, when we merely have people screaming on street corners and sleeping in the gutter. Institutionalization should've been reformed, not all but eliminated (I know it still exists, but only for the most extreme cases).

Well, the support network is far from perfect - having a 5yo son in the autistic spectrum I experience this first hand. Not too long ago my kid would be segregated to a "special" school and I'm glad he is able to attend a regular school although he still needs a dedicated tutor.

Do you think weird people that do not endanger their own life or the life of others should be locked away?

Re: Why what we think we know about schizophrenia is wrong

#34

Post by DanBC »

asveikau wrote: post #12
coleifer wrote: post #8

My youngest brother has schizophrenia, which started when he was 19. He just turned 31, and were it not for his family supporting and caring for him, I'm sure he would be homeless or worse. He's one of the most sensitive, gentle people I have ever known. My wife and others who have gotten to know him would agree. Although he's "stable", thanks to an injection every 3 weeks, he's not going to ever get better. In fact…

It might be he doesn't want to associate with people, groups, events that revolve around the diagnosis. Perhaps that labels him an "other" and it feels little much. Why not similar activities with the general population? That is not meant to belittle the point that delusional people will strongly deny their symptoms, of course. Being close to somebody like that gets tough, especially when the delusions have led to ha…

> Why not similar activities with the general population?

This is something that has been recommended for many years. Rahter than day centres where mentally ill people can go, secluded away from the world, we should provide a wider range. Still have those day centres for the people who need it, but focus on helping people reintegrate with their local communities by using "mainstream" services.

Here's a pdf from 2006, but there are earlier examples. https://lx.iriss.org.uk/sites/default/files/resources/Redesi...

Re: Why what we think we know about schizophrenia is wrong

#35

Post by thatoneuser »

DanBC wrote: post #10

> It was during my own nursing training that the currently favoured term of “service user” gained traction, as it was deemed more neutral. Patients overwhelmingly prefer the term patient, and this holds true every time we ask them what they want to be called. Service user is a term imposed upon them by well-intentioned mental health professionals and academics who don't recognise their own power dynamic and who do a…

Academics can be the dumbest smart people.

Re: Why what we think we know about schizophrenia is wrong

#36

Post by isnetea »

I’ve often wondered if it’s possible to induce psychosis and symptoms of schizophrenia in a subject via environmental conditioning. This seems practical to test these days, given the expanse of information possessed by large tech companies, and their lack of regulation. Perhaps this would be related research for a larger automated behavior control initiative. Does anyone have any pertinent references or info?

Re: Why what we think we know about schizophrenia is wrong

#37

Post by thatoneuser »

jquery wrote: post #6
scardine wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think "one flew over the cuckoo's nest" romanticizes mental illness, for me it is about demonizing institutionalization. It pictures the time when mental illness diagnostic was an easy method to put away anyone annoying or inconvenient (the subject really having a mental illness or not made little difference). It talks about institutional cruelty like torture and lobotomy. But then I didn't read the book, jus…

I mostly agree, but I think the movie romanticized the end of institutionalization, making us believe we've progressed "beyond" it, when we merely have people screaming on street corners and sleeping in the gutter. Institutionalization should've been reformed, not all but eliminated (I know it still exists, but only for the most extreme cases).

We've absolutely progressed beyond lobotomies, caregivers raping or assaulting patients (...more so anyway), and in general lifelong imprisonment in sub human conditions. No were not all the way where we need to be but we're miles ahead of where we were.

Re: Why what we think we know about schizophrenia is wrong

#38

Post by thatoneuser »

pygy_ wrote: post #15

Treating DSM categories as if they were a single disease is completely misguided. The DSM describes syndromes, and ignores pathophysiology because we still have little to no idea of what happens in the brain (at least not enough to properly understand the relevant functional aspects). Genome-wide association studies have recently shown that schizophrenia was in fact several distinct diseases [0]. Their symptoms turn…

This is why I think very highly of the transition in DSM V to diagnosing on spectrums. It's not perfect but it really helps get away from putting people into buckets they don't really belong in.

Re: Why what we think we know about schizophrenia is wrong

#39

Post by yosys »

ordu wrote: post #30
yosys wrote: post #22

I dislike psychiatry grossly because the victims of the field are not compensated by how the errors destroy the victim's life. I'm a person who was medicated with the older & new generation of antipsychotics for two years of my early 20s because I was suffering religious conversion therapy "best I can describe it" from family and where I was in circumstances any other person would have great amounts of stress. The ou…

There is a book "A Road Back from Schizophrenia: A Memoir"[1]. Arnhild Lauveng came back from schizophrenia, got a degree in psychology and wrote the book, describing how it feels to have a schizophrenia. She describes doctors too. A bad ones and also those, who helped her to get back from schizophrenia. I believe you would like that book, her experiences are like yours. [1] https://www.amazon.com/Road-Back-Schizophr…

No, the experience was meaningless like life and nothing more than torture. I believe the field will die slowly and my life was worthless. I plan to act on suicide in the near future because of the torture.

Re: Why what we think we know about schizophrenia is wrong

#40

Post by thatoneuser »

qrbLPHiKpiux wrote: post #3

Much, if not all, of mental health is based on theories and assumptions." "It's thought that..." when referring to how medications work. Let's just agree that we all know nothing about mental health.

We clearly know a lot. Not everything but you're lumping things way too black and white.
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