31–40 of 224 posts
Earlier quoted context omitted.
Honestly it feels like it should be illegal. If a cop or a cop-simulacrum walks up to me and says "You're going to jail unless you give me this" I'm probably going to give them that. I don't want to go to jail and I know they'll cook something up about resisting arrest if I don't play along.
If the state of Washington made it illegal it couldn't effect ICE though could it, since they're a part of the federal government?
> "Motel 6's actions tore families apart and violated the privacy rights of tens of thousands of Washingtonians," What? I'm pretty sure ICE's actions were what tore those families apart. Why aren't they being punished for illegally requesting the data without a warrant? Maybe the Motel 6 employees who wrongfully gave the data felt pressured, given that ICE is a government agency just like the DOJ?
ICE only enforce the laws that already exists.
So only two possible parties are at fault here:
1. Congress, if the current laws are bad.
2. Parents, if they are in violation of the law.
> "Motel 6's actions tore families apart and violated the privacy rights of tens of thousands of Washingtonians," What? I'm pretty sure ICE's actions were what tore those families apart. Why aren't they being punished for illegally requesting the data without a warrant? Maybe the Motel 6 employees who wrongfully gave the data felt pressured, given that ICE is a government agency just like the DOJ?
This is not the first time law enforcement has gone for motel records, nor even local cops being friendly with the night attendant. Motel 6 should be (or should have been) telling their employees that they aren't required to hand out any information without a court order or warrant.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
Perhaps it's not illegal by the letter of the law, but it certainly seems like a major injustice to me. Could it be considered entrapment if Motel 6 was pressured into giving ICE the information?
> Could it be considered entrapment if Motel 6 was pressured into giving ICE the information? No, because ICE agents are not agents of the State of Washington, and the prosecution was by the State for violations of State law. ICE agents are, in terms of entrapment, no different than ISIS agents would be in this case. EDIT: Also no, because entrapment is a criminal defense, and this was a civil consumer protection cas…
ICE agents have some degree of lawful authority legally vested in them at some level of American governance, so it stands to reason that individuals can make the claim they felt 'required by some law' to do as that agency apparently behoved of them.
Especially if ICE were making statements along the lines of 'you're legally required to do this or that', then there's an issue here.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
Part of the trouble is ICE's "requests" are not always purported as requests. See recent attempt in New York by ICE agent that he had a legally enforceable warrant and that his goal of detaining a vehicle occupant was not simply a request. [1] The ICE officer in this case even quotes a statute that implied the driver might face penalties for not complying with the officer's demands. Given this behavior, I wonder what…
If ICE had compelled Motel 6 to hand over the lists, that would be a very different thing and we would be having a very different conversation. But that's not what happened, and let's not pretend like that is what happened. ICE asked nicely, expecting to be turned down by Motel 6 like most other hotel chains did. But Motel 6 went along with the request without any sort of coercion and in fact in violation of local co…
Earlier quoted context omitted.
Honestly it feels like it should be illegal. If a cop or a cop-simulacrum walks up to me and says "You're going to jail unless you give me this" I'm probably going to give them that. I don't want to go to jail and I know they'll cook something up about resisting arrest if I don't play along.
If the state of Washington made it illegal it couldn't effect ICE though could it, since they're a part of the federal government?
Because the truth is that requiring a warrant won't do the trick. If the cop-like says he doesn't need a warrant I'm going to listen to him. I should always comply in the moment or "we'll do things the hard way". Then afterwards maybe I can sue.
Why would ICE run "latino-sounding" names through and not just all names through whatever ICE database they're cross-referencing? Did they get a 10,000 page print out instead of a spreadsheet file? (why not Scan + OCR + cross reference with database - would be way faster) Just seems like ICE employees are only targeting latinos... intentionally. And that's the most bothering part of this to me. We're cool with Swedes…
Probably because it's not 1 million Swedes entering the country illegally every year.
Why would ICE run "latino-sounding" names through and not just all names through whatever ICE database they're cross-referencing? Did they get a 10,000 page print out instead of a spreadsheet file? (why not Scan + OCR + cross reference with database - would be way faster) Just seems like ICE employees are only targeting latinos... intentionally. And that's the most bothering part of this to me. We're cool with Swedes…
Probably because it's not 1 million Swedes entering the country illegally every year.
[0] a recent extension to the Law now requires the same also for the "short rentals" which then include also all AirBnb and similar
This is... strange. When the federal government comes asking for your help, I think it's pretty normal for people to provide that help. In a just world, if the government asks for something inappropriately, then the party at fault is the government. (In other words, Washington should sue ICE, not Motel 6.) If we want companies to require a subpoena to share information with the federal government (and personally I do…
They are fined for improperly handing over data. It seems we have already set that standard in law.