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Google removed my ads-free app for “deceptive ads”

purpleleafsoftware.com

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Re: Google removed my ads-free app for “deceptive ads”

#31

Post by echelon »

hug wrote: post #22
echelon wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I think in fact a lot of people do want them to do this. I, the engineer, do not want them to do this. Before Google and Apple, I didn't have this problem. I didn't have to pay their tax or march to their beat. You might argue that it's their platform and that's the cost for us to pay. But it wasn't always this way! These companies leveraged their advantages to steal eyeballs away from an open web and lock them in…

> Before Google and Apple, I didn't have this problem. I didn't have to pay their tax or march to their beat. You still don't! You don't have the play by their rules, and you can still target everyone who has a non-Google or non-Apple phone, which as a target market is appreciably no one, much as it was before Google and Apple entered the phone market. You can target them if they have phones produced by your hated ma…

> back to a time that never existed

Personal PCs were just this back in the 90's and 00's. Microsoft tried to create a walled garden, but it failed due to the world wide web.

Google and Apple saw how Microsoft failed and decided that the app store would be a first class citizen on day one and that the mobile web [1] would be an afterthought. They learned from Microsoft's mistake and used their positions to make app stores the new status quo.

It could have easily gone a different way, but I understand how the business interests got us to where we are.

[1] the mobile web wouldn't have been nice without more money and research poured into it. The web stack could have been supplemented or a new one could have been developed. These companies obviously had other priorities than to pay for something that netted them nothing, but individual developers wound out worse for it.

Re: Google removed my ads-free app for “deceptive ads”

#34

Post by kyralis »

echelon wrote: post #31
hug wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Before Google and Apple, I didn't have this problem. I didn't have to pay their tax or march to their beat. You still don't! You don't have the play by their rules, and you can still target everyone who has a non-Google or non-Apple phone, which as a target market is appreciably no one, much as it was before Google and Apple entered the phone market. You can target them if they have phones produced by your hated ma…

> back to a time that never existed Personal PCs were just this back in the 90's and 00's. Microsoft tried to create a walled garden, but it failed due to the world wide web . Google and Apple saw how Microsoft failed and decided that the app store would be a first class citizen on day one and that the mobile web [1] would be an afterthought. They learned from Microsoft's mistake and used their positions to make app…

Actually, you've got that history a little backward. The original iPhone had no App Store and had only web apps; that was the promoted way to develop for the platform. It was only after the phone's release and the mad clamor from developers to be allowed to develop native applications that an SDK was released and the App Store created.

Re: Google removed my ads-free app for “deceptive ads”

#35

Post by ucaetano »

echelon wrote: post #27
ucaetano wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> We need similar laws to protect startups, small businesses, and sole proprietors Yeah, because laws protecting inefficient business are great for society and consumers. No business "deserves" protection. Consumers do, but not business.

App stores are monopolies, and their governance leaves much to be desired (as is the subject of this article). I'm fine paying the AWS tax. It's a generic utility more or less and I can just as easily use Azure or Google (assuming you're not baked into certain offerings, but that's out of scope and honestly is a choice .) If you want on Android there's no choice. You play by Google's rules and pay their tax. People g…

> App stores are monopolies

That is a huge claim, thrown around by you with no backing. You could get a few economists to discuss that for ages without reaching a conclusion.

Unless you're talking about the layman's definition of monopoly, which means "whatever I want it to mean".

This is particularly relevant when there's the Amazon app store, and app preloads, and the Korean app store, and Fortnite isn't available on the Play store.

And that's before we get into the fact that iOS competes with Android, and that includes the app stores. This would be like complaining that to get a product to be sold by Walmart, you need to get Walmart to sell it.

No matter how you look at it, consumers never had so many choices, prices have never been this low, and app distribution has never been so easy.

Re: Google removed my ads-free app for “deceptive ads”

#36

Post by _jgvg »

echelon wrote: post #16
KirinDave wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> No single entity should wield this much power. And we should rewrite the laws to make this so. I think in fact a lot of people do want them to do this. Folks complain the Play store is full of malware and spam, and that there are data leaks and deceptive ads. Then Google or Apple goes and removes them, and then folks are mad if that process has errors. It seems like a business where you make everyone mad no matter…

> I think in fact a lot of people do want them to do this. I, the engineer, do not want them to do this. Before Google and Apple, I didn't have this problem. I didn't have to pay their tax or march to their beat. You might argue that it's their platform and that's the cost for us to pay. But it wasn't always this way! These companies leveraged their advantages to steal eyeballs away from an open web and lock them in…

> I, the engineer, do not want them to do this.

You don't matter, consumers matter.

> Before Google and Apple, I didn't have this problem.

And you didn't have distribution either.

> But it wasn't always this way!

Indeed, there wasn't even distribution. Do you actually remember what was shipping mobile software back in 2005?

> I want them to pay back the negative externalities they've leveraged onto us.

Again, you as an engineer don't matter, only as a consumer. And consumers have never had so many options and at such low prices.

Re: Google removed my ads-free app for “deceptive ads”

#37

Post by mrschwabe »

Why anyone would develop apps for Apple/Google duopoly is beyond me.

Right, I get that you may need the money - but if your livelihood depends on money earned from making this world a worser place perhaps it is time to gut check and determine what really is your purpose and best use of time; maybe (easy) money is not all it's cut out to be in that context.

Re: Google removed my ads-free app for “deceptive ads”

#38

Post by m-p-3 »

joeframbach wrote: post #9
echelon wrote: post #8

Can we sue Google when they do things like this? No single entity should wield this much power. And we should rewrite the laws to make this so. Google and Apple wanted to be in the role of gatekeeper, so they should be beholden to the apps on their platform. We had a web where developers were in control of their own deployment. Everything was decentralized and required responsibility and diligence. Now the power is o…

> And there would probably be better privacy in the world where Mozilla won instead of Google. In that world Mozilla wouldn't sell your data to Pocket or Stranger Things or whoever knows a bizdev at Mozilla?

Pocket belongs to Mozilla FYI.

Re: Google removed my ads-free app for “deceptive ads”

#39

Post by dwighttk »

ocdtrekkie wrote: post #19
KirinDave wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> No single entity should wield this much power. And we should rewrite the laws to make this so. I think in fact a lot of people do want them to do this. Folks complain the Play store is full of malware and spam, and that there are data leaks and deceptive ads. Then Google or Apple goes and removes them, and then folks are mad if that process has errors. It seems like a business where you make everyone mad no matter…

The problem is the process is largely automated, both for approval and removal. If trash wasn't let into the Play Store in the first place, there wouldn't be so many issues with pulling content back out of it. Consumers and developers alike would be far better off dealing with a properly human-curated store with actual customer service, even if it meant there were less apps in it.

This is Google. If you want human-curated go to Yahoo!

Re: Google removed my ads-free app for “deceptive ads”

#40

Post by bitL »

echelon wrote: post #8

Can we sue Google when they do things like this? No single entity should wield this much power. And we should rewrite the laws to make this so. Google and Apple wanted to be in the role of gatekeeper, so they should be beholden to the apps on their platform. We had a web where developers were in control of their own deployment. Everything was decentralized and required responsibility and diligence. Now the power is o…

If Mozilla folks weren't so inflexible, we could have had writable local file access long time ago (Google was pushing that actually), making PWAs with WebAssembly viable desktop app replacements, rendering walled gardens useless. Yet here we are when a heuristics in a bot causes false positives with far reaching consequences and customer support is ran as an automated joke as well, making innocent victims helpless.
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