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Prenatal testosterone linked to long-term effects in females with male twin
31–40 of 57 posts
Re: Prenatal testosterone linked to long-term effects in females with male twin
#32Earlier quoted context omitted.
Technically a somewhat clever pun, but currently that’s such an emotionally charged issue that no one wants it brought up unless it’s relevant. Either that or it may sound like you’re insulting all males.
It's very American reaction. As an Eastern European I find it's just funny.
No, I’m American and found it one of the funniest comments I’ve read in a while.
Re: Prenatal testosterone linked to long-term effects in females with male twin
#33With smaller data sets I find the summary to be less valuable than the actual paper. In this case we are talking about 4,533 twin pairs where one is a male and the other female. The female twin had a 2.8-percentage point higher probability of dropping out of high school compared to other female students, and a similar 1.9-percentage point lower probability of graduating from college. Those two numbers seems connected…
Does it compare them to girl-girl twins?
Re: Prenatal testosterone linked to long-term effects in females with male twin
#34My girlfriend has a twin brother. Since they were born in Haiti and we live in the US I'm not sure how relevant this study would be towards her, meaning the socioeconomic changes between living in those two countries is pretty wide. How does prenatal test affect someone after they've gone through puberty? I just don't see how that can be attributed towards college graduation or marriage rates. Is that not a far reach…
> How does prenatal test affect someone after they've gone through puberty The test doesn't affect them. Hormone levels during development are the primary way the body controls development, so even small alterations in hormone levels in utero would be expected to have large physiological consequences. > Is that not a far reaching statement to associate the two Luckily, the field of statistics gives us ways to reason…
Being statistically illiterate, could I get an explanation of of "The p-values for all the reported effects are presented in the appendix [2] and ranged from I'd like to share this with her, but neither of us know stats so the significance is kinda lost.
Re: Prenatal testosterone linked to long-term effects in females with male twin
#35With smaller data sets I find the summary to be less valuable than the actual paper. In this case we are talking about 4,533 twin pairs where one is a male and the other female. The female twin had a 2.8-percentage point higher probability of dropping out of high school compared to other female students, and a similar 1.9-percentage point lower probability of graduating from college. Those two numbers seems connected…
Does it compare them to girl-girl twins?
Sort of. It compares female-female to male-female twin pairs in analyzing subsequent maternal fertility, to ensure the relevance of the deceased co-twin approach.
Search for 'Table S5' in the paper and the appendix.
Re: Prenatal testosterone linked to long-term effects in females with male twin
#36Re: Prenatal testosterone linked to long-term effects in females with male twin
#37Earlier quoted context omitted.
It's very American reaction. As an Eastern European I find it's just funny.
No, I’m American and found it one of the funniest comments I’ve read in a while.
It is so nice to come on HN and get some relief from the monotonous humorlessness that is life in USA today. For a moment, I imagine that I can laugh at funny statements no matter which way they point politically, rather than restricting my entertainment to grumbling in approved ways about whomever we're supposed to despise now.
Re: Prenatal testosterone linked to long-term effects in females with male twin
#38Earlier quoted context omitted.
Technically a somewhat clever pun, but currently that’s such an emotionally charged issue that no one wants it brought up unless it’s relevant. Either that or it may sound like you’re insulting all males.
It's very American reaction. As an Eastern European I find it's just funny.
Also “N. American” [1] Also found it funny.
It’s a WASP thing. They were killjoys when they got kicked out of Europe four centuries ago. They’re kill joys today.
Today, shocked at their ancestors’ crimes, they dilute their sense of responsibility by dropping the ASP, and making broad generalizations about whites (really, who did the Balkans ever hurt other than themselves? What harm have the Amish done to ethnic minorities?)
[1] (also Latin@ ?? - can’t keep track.)
Re: Prenatal testosterone linked to long-term effects in females with male twin
#39Earlier quoted context omitted.
> How does prenatal test affect someone after they've gone through puberty The test doesn't affect them. Hormone levels during development are the primary way the body controls development, so even small alterations in hormone levels in utero would be expected to have large physiological consequences. > Is that not a far reaching statement to associate the two Luckily, the field of statistics gives us ways to reason…
Being statistically illiterate, could I get an explanation of of "The p-values for all the reported effects are presented in the appendix [2] and ranged from I'd like to share this with her, but neither of us know stats so the significance is kinda lost.
Sure.
P-value is the universal* way of expressing statistical likelihood. It corresponds to a percentage: p=.05 just means 5%, and p=.001 means 0.1%, etc.
It's often inaccurately explained as the likelihood of getting our results through chance alone. That's wrong for reasons that are technically important, but not in a way that really inhibits understanding of the strength of results that have small p-values.
* It has flaws, and a growing number of researchers believe it should not have the prominent importance currently placed on it.
---- Stop reading here if you're already satisfied. ----
We want to measure if there's a difference between two groups. So, we take measurements of a portion of group A, and measurements of a portion of group B.
Mathematically, we assume that what we've actually done is sampled from the same population both times. If that's true, our data sets should be quite similar to one another, but of course there will be some difference just due to noise.
So, we compute mathematically the chance of seeing a difference at least as large as the one we see between our data sets, if that assumption is true.
We decide beforehand on a small error rate. If not otherwise stated, 5% (p=.05) is the universal standard.
If we find that the likelihood of observing a same-or-larger difference between the populations is smaller than that already-small 5% chance, we REJECT our assumption that the samples came from the same population, and conclude that the populations must actually be different.
In other words, we conclude that we measured an actual difference that contrasts two mathematically-separate populations.
Re: Prenatal testosterone linked to long-term effects in females with male twin
#40Earlier quoted context omitted.
"Unlike the females, the researchers found that male twins do not experience long-term consequences of being exposed to a female twin in utero."
That's not what I asked. I asked what effect in utero testosterone had on boys. Did they have lower metrics than their sisters? Did boys with higher levels of in utero testosterone have lower metrics than boys with lower levels of in utero testosterone?
I'm not sure how they would go about experiment design for this.
In the case of twins they know the mechanism for increased testosterone, and they have a big control population. Short of everyone having a prenatal hormone measurement (which presumably is not done typically) how would you identify the subjects?