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Whitespace killed an enterprise app

uxdesign.cc

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Re: Whitespace killed an enterprise app

#31

Post by oblio »

maxxxxx wrote: post #26
oblio wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can do it, but it requires tons and tons of effort. And even after all that, you can't escape the backlash. There's a great series by Jensen Harris, Office Program Manager, about how they designed the Ribbon: https://blogs.msdn.microsoft.com/jensenh/2005/09/26/the-why-... (you can find the rest in his blog archives, unfortunately the images are gone) It was an incredibly complex undertaking, Microsoft did many st…

I don’t know how they come up with the numbers but I still think that menus and toolbars were much more discoverable and faster to use than the ribbon :)

QED. I rest my case :)

https://blogs.msdn.microsoft.com/jensenh/2005/10/31/inside-d...

Re: Whitespace killed an enterprise app

#32

Post by stronglikedan »

duxup wrote: post #19
danielvaughn wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

God yes, the older reddit interface was so much better. I don't give a shit how pretty the UI is.

I use ud.reddit.com Although anytime I mention this I fear they'll take it away...

Just out of curiosity, why "ud"? It seems like any two letter subdomain works in the same way.

Re: Whitespace killed an enterprise app

#33

Post by duxup »

varikin wrote: post #27
duxup wrote: post #8

One point: >Are there things my users really don’t need to see right now? If you don’t know, ask! ASK! ASK! ASK! For the love of god please ask your users. I worked for a company with a big clunky enterprise app. It got redesigned numerous times and rolled out with big fanfare. Nobody who used for any significant amount of time was involved in any of the redesigns. It was horrible every time with numerous changes jus…

> ASK! ASK! ASK! Except users lie all the time. They don't know what they need or want. People are horrible at being logical about what will actually help them. Watch them work. Watch a bunch of people work. Test and prototype changes and watch more people work. And watch them work at their desk or where ever they work.

I probabbly didn't emphasize it enough but yeah you give them something mvp like and watch them and get feed back on it.

Recently, I actually forgot to make a whole series of changes on a dashboard that were requested. They hated the old version .... but I didn't change it before the next meeting ... and then they loved it at the recent meeting. It was the same one they hated on.

Sometimes you also just have to let them get used to it too ;)

It's an iterative process no doubt, but as a dev... I'm no better at knowing what I'll do too. Iv'e worked something up and weeks later changed it completely after I've used it.

Re: Whitespace killed an enterprise app

#34

Post by carlmr »

varikin wrote: post #27
duxup wrote: post #8

One point: >Are there things my users really don’t need to see right now? If you don’t know, ask! ASK! ASK! ASK! For the love of god please ask your users. I worked for a company with a big clunky enterprise app. It got redesigned numerous times and rolled out with big fanfare. Nobody who used for any significant amount of time was involved in any of the redesigns. It was horrible every time with numerous changes jus…

> ASK! ASK! ASK! Except users lie all the time. They don't know what they need or want. People are horrible at being logical about what will actually help them. Watch them work. Watch a bunch of people work. Test and prototype changes and watch more people work. And watch them work at their desk or where ever they work.

Why not both? It's not even that people lie, but they might not know what's possible, limiting the amount of information they will give you.

Re: Whitespace killed an enterprise app

#35

Post by fermienrico »

jasode wrote: post #22

>a well-intentioned UX Designer at a large high-tech company who was given a new project: Redesign an internal control panel that was ugly [...] It lasted one month before the company was forced to retire it. Users absolutely hated the new system. Sure, the old system was ugly, but it had everything they needed, right at their fingertips! Their jobs were incredibly fast paced—they worked in a tech support call center…

I can't believe how many times I've heard your story but in different companies.

I feel like there is an opportunity to make a graphical user interface framework that mimics old terminals. Full screen apps that leverage use of the keyboard shortcuts or hell even a custom keyboard specifically made for industrial use. Basically a IBM 400 system but running on modern software stack. Airlines have stuck with their UI and for good reasons.

Re: Whitespace killed an enterprise app

#36

Post by ThomPete »

varikin wrote: post #27
duxup wrote: post #8

One point: >Are there things my users really don’t need to see right now? If you don’t know, ask! ASK! ASK! ASK! For the love of god please ask your users. I worked for a company with a big clunky enterprise app. It got redesigned numerous times and rolled out with big fanfare. Nobody who used for any significant amount of time was involved in any of the redesigns. It was horrible every time with numerous changes jus…

> ASK! ASK! ASK! Except users lie all the time. They don't know what they need or want. People are horrible at being logical about what will actually help them. Watch them work. Watch a bunch of people work. Test and prototype changes and watch more people work. And watch them work at their desk or where ever they work.

Exactly. Asking users is only interesting if you know what you are looking for and you have to ask around the questions instead of leading them to answer. 90% of the time observing is what you want.

Re: Whitespace killed an enterprise app

#37

Post by kwhitefoot »

In the "Use color deliberately" paragraph the table has a column of numbers that are left justified. This makes comparing adjacent rows very awkward. The should be right justified. This is such a simple thing to get right yet it is nonetheless very common that it is done wrong.

Re: Whitespace killed an enterprise app

#38

Post by rgoulter »

oblio wrote: post #23
maxxxxx wrote: post #9

It seems a lot of UIs these days are designed for beginners instead of people who know what they are doing. Someone’s this is OK but in a professional conetwxt it often isn’t. I can’t even imagine if IDEs like Visual Studio were designed “spacious” and “minimalistic”. It would look cute but you wouldn’t get anything done. Some things are just complex and there is no way to design that away without hurting productivit…

You can do it, but it requires tons and tons of effort. And even after all that, you can't escape the backlash. There's a great series by Jensen Harris, Office Program Manager, about how they designed the Ribbon: https://blogs.msdn.microsoft.com/jensenh/2005/09/26/the-why-... (you can find the rest in his blog archives, unfortunately the images are gone) It was an incredibly complex undertaking, Microsoft did many st…

This entertaining diatribe about Sibelius' difficult to use design mentions poor use of a Ribbon. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dKx1wnXClcI

Re: Whitespace killed an enterprise app

#39

Post by michaelbuckbee »

Never underestimate the power of a data entry person working in a high volume organization with an app that looks like it was designed in 1975.

I worked on a potential redesign of the US Navy's medical appointment booking application and the data entry rate and responsiveness of their "ancient" system was far superior to the newly proposed solution (web based).

Re: Whitespace killed an enterprise app

#40

Post by duxup »

stronglikedan wrote: post #32
duxup wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I use ud.reddit.com Although anytime I mention this I fear they'll take it away...

Just out of curiosity, why "ud"? It seems like any two letter subdomain works in the same way.

Honestly, I think that was just one I bookmarked at some point and there it is in my history ;)
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