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Denmark to ban petrol and diesel car sales by 2030

euractiv.com

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Re: Denmark to ban petrol and diesel car sales by 2030

#31

Post by rb808 »

gambiting wrote: post #3

As great as it is, remember that hybrids are exempt. And the law is very lax when it comes to a definition of a hybrid - Range Rover has a model with a whooping 1 mile(!!!) of electric range, but of course it has an electric motor so it qualifies as a hybrid and could still be sold under this ban. I expect very very soon we'll see this kind of extremely minor electrification coming to all kinds of vehicles, where a t…

> 1 mile(!!!) of electric range,

Other people have talked about this, but I'm wondering if the change to having electric drive motors and an engine just for generating electricity is more efficient and easier on the engine. (regenerative breaking aside)

Re: Denmark to ban petrol and diesel car sales by 2030

#32

Post by rcMgD2BwE72F »

ainiriand wrote: post #27
PopeDotNinja wrote: post #26

I went to Denmark last year and spent two weeks driving all over the countryside, and likely would have been difficult to reach with an electric car. Many of the places I visited would not have been accessible via public transit. I'm curious how future generations will reach remote places as we move away from fossil fuels. BTW, I loved Denmark :)

I guess the solution is to provide more charging stations, isn't it? Looks pretty straightforward to me.

What's more widely distributed than electricity?

Re: Denmark to ban petrol and diesel car sales by 2030

#33

Post by stephengillie »

gambiting wrote: post #3

As great as it is, remember that hybrids are exempt. And the law is very lax when it comes to a definition of a hybrid - Range Rover has a model with a whooping 1 mile(!!!) of electric range, but of course it has an electric motor so it qualifies as a hybrid and could still be sold under this ban. I expect very very soon we'll see this kind of extremely minor electrification coming to all kinds of vehicles, where a t…

You would be surprised how many times you use that one EV mile during the average 30 mile commute. In traffic and cities, you often don't need more than the 40 HP given by the transmission alone.

Hybrids have a torque curve that starts like an EV, then continues like a gas car. This means great torque from 0 mph through highway speeds.

And then there's idle at stop lights, the biggest waste of fuel and a huge cause of pollution. Modern engines use 6 seconds of fuel when starting, but most cars idle for minutes at a light.

Re: Denmark to ban petrol and diesel car sales by 2030

#34

Post by [deleted] »

jstanley wrote: post #16
reacharavindh wrote: post #13

Wonder what it'd do to the resale value of cars even before 2030. Denmark with their famous 150% registration tax already has cars being used much longer than what I've seen in other countries. I'd love to see the 150% tax waived off for 100% electric cars that are not luxury vehicles. Set strict constraints for a common man car, and incentivize it turning electric. Also, think about the charging infrastructure....

Why does it make any difference whether it is a luxury vehicle or not?

[deleted]

Re: Denmark to ban petrol and diesel car sales by 2030

#35

Post by zymhan »

rcMgD2BwE72F wrote: post #32
ainiriand wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I guess the solution is to provide more charging stations, isn't it? Looks pretty straightforward to me.

What's more widely distributed than electricity?

Find me high-voltage high-amperage connections on the side of the freeway though.

Re: Denmark to ban petrol and diesel car sales by 2030

#36

Post by jjuhl »

jimmaswell wrote: post #22
reacharavindh wrote: post #13

Wonder what it'd do to the resale value of cars even before 2030. Denmark with their famous 150% registration tax already has cars being used much longer than what I've seen in other countries. I'd love to see the 150% tax waived off for 100% electric cars that are not luxury vehicles. Set strict constraints for a common man car, and incentivize it turning electric. Also, think about the charging infrastructure....

I never understood how anyone possibly felt the ridiculously extremist state of affairs of automobile/fuel regulations/taxes/etc in Denmark is appropriate. The rest of Europe isn't that great either but Denmark is one of or the most insane examples (memory isn't clear on if there was another member state that was even worse). One of the things that makes me grateful to live in the USA - owning and operating a car doe…

I don't see why it's insane to put huge taxes on something that polutes our environment, is dangerous to people around them, causes a lot of noise and other irritations. Pushing more people towards electric and public transportation is only a good thing in my opinion. If you insist on a poluting private car, fine, just pay for it (big time).

Re: Denmark to ban petrol and diesel car sales by 2030

#38

Post by icebraining »

jimmaswell wrote: post #22
reacharavindh wrote: post #13

Wonder what it'd do to the resale value of cars even before 2030. Denmark with their famous 150% registration tax already has cars being used much longer than what I've seen in other countries. I'd love to see the 150% tax waived off for 100% electric cars that are not luxury vehicles. Set strict constraints for a common man car, and incentivize it turning electric. Also, think about the charging infrastructure....

I never understood how anyone possibly felt the ridiculously extremist state of affairs of automobile/fuel regulations/taxes/etc in Denmark is appropriate. The rest of Europe isn't that great either but Denmark is one of or the most insane examples (memory isn't clear on if there was another member state that was even worse). One of the things that makes me grateful to live in the USA - owning and operating a car doe…

Considering that Denmark in 30th in the world in the number of cars per capita, above France, the UK, Sweden and the Netherlands, doesn't seem that problematic.

Re: Denmark to ban petrol and diesel car sales by 2030

#39

Post by floatrock »

seanalltogether wrote: post #5

Instead of governments announcing bans (I believe france announced a future ban a couple months back), I would rather see these governments committing to only purchasing electric vehicles for all government fleets. Why not put your money were your mouth is and help pump money into the industry via purchasing orders, rather then simply announcing a ban?

As with most things in life, it's not black-and-white... both are happening (although fleet vehicles tend to be more visible at the municipal level). You do still need national-level policy to set market certainty and reduce risk, though (a car maker is much more likely to invest in significant retooling if they're guaranteed a market for that retooling).

Even in the US, the USPS is experimenting with electric mail trucks: https://about.usps.com/what-we-are-doing/green/vehicles.htm

If the ban is the stick, the best return on the carrots would be increasing public charging infrastructure. SF runs chargers in front of city hall, for example.

Re: Denmark to ban petrol and diesel car sales by 2030

#40

Post by rcMgD2BwE72F »

dsfyu404ed wrote: post #17
jrnvs wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't forget that car companies plan years ahead. Setting an end-date like this brings the subject on the table of the car companies' board rooms.

And setting an impossible to implement date of 2020 is a great way to ensure they donate their money to whoever's running against you.

Then, you have a much bigger problem to solve (your campaign finance system). This looks like corruption to me but I'm no US citizen.
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