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FanDuel not honoring bet that would have paid over $82,000 due to line error

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Re: FanDuel not honoring bet that would have paid over $82,000 due to line error

#31

Post by girvo »

setr wrote: post #15
komali2 wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They tried 500$ and 3 Giants tickets, which he declined in favor of getting a lawyer. I think they should bite the bullet, pay it out, turn to their software engineers, and say "it's worth 82,000$ to this company to ensure that never happens again."

Its accidentally $82,000. If you allow such a bug to be honored, then potentially it could manage a near-infinite payout. Such bugs becomes not a costly mistake but instead existentially threatening And we certainly don’t have a software industry capable of supporting that environment

Sure, but in this case it’s not an infinite payout. And the courts will care about that more than an engineering hypothetical, i would wager.

Re: FanDuel not honoring bet that would have paid over $82,000 due to line error

#33

Post by dumbfounder »

cesis wrote: post #30
dumbfounder wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Disgusting? So if you see a sign on a car for sale that says $19,95 because a digit fell off, the dealer is obligated to sell it to you at that price? People and systems make mistakes, that doesn't mean it's "disgusting" that they protect themselves financially from those mistakes.

It's more like - dealer sold you the car for $19.95, then came after you and demanded the rest $19k because of the error.

If you bought it online you bet they would come after you.

Re: FanDuel not honoring bet that would have paid over $82,000 due to line error

#34

Post by girvo »

lifeisstillgood wrote: post #17

>>> industry practice, which specifically address such obvious pricing errors. I am in two minds here. Firstly this is a "contract" - honour it. Secondly, I understand the industry practise, but Indont think it is in line with society needs - that is a human bookmaker would never have given 750-1 with the team leading and minutes to go. So either you write software that won't do that and take the risk, or you stop us…

Exactly. The bookmakers are pretending that their software is human, and thus should have human fixes applied as if it was a real bookie. But they’re literally making billions of addiction, why should we have sympathy for this company?

Re: FanDuel not honoring bet that would have paid over $82,000 due to line error

#35

Post by draw_down »

TwitchySeal wrote: post #25
ddingus wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly. What they could do is pay this guy off, then follow the good press for a very likely net gain.

Except then they have to pay out every other time there's a bug.

Sounds like a great incentive to fix the bugs to me!

Re: FanDuel not honoring bet that would have paid over $82,000 due to line error

#36

Post by jonknee »

setr wrote: post #15
komali2 wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They tried 500$ and 3 Giants tickets, which he declined in favor of getting a lawyer. I think they should bite the bullet, pay it out, turn to their software engineers, and say "it's worth 82,000$ to this company to ensure that never happens again."

Its accidentally $82,000. If you allow such a bug to be honored, then potentially it could manage a near-infinite payout. Such bugs becomes not a costly mistake but instead existentially threatening And we certainly don’t have a software industry capable of supporting that environment

If you can't afford the errors you should not be in the business (but they can easily afford this error).

Re: FanDuel not honoring bet that would have paid over $82,000 due to line error

#37

Post by heavymark »

TwitchySeal wrote: post #25
ddingus wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly. What they could do is pay this guy off, then follow the good press for a very likely net gain.

Except then they have to pay out every other time there's a bug.

I imagine if they had to honor, they would make it priority number one resolving those bugs, and make changes to make the bugs more apparent to people in the process. If they don't have to pay, there isn't much of an incentive to prioritize the fixes, especially since I imagine if the bugs are in the favor of the company they can make a lot of money.

Re: FanDuel not honoring bet that would have paid over $82,000 due to line error

#38

Post by jonknee »

ddingus wrote: post #20
setr wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Its accidentally $82,000. If you allow such a bug to be honored, then potentially it could manage a near-infinite payout. Such bugs becomes not a costly mistake but instead existentially threatening And we certainly don’t have a software industry capable of supporting that environment

Best use humans then. Otherwise there is no trust. You know they did not inform people of errors the other way.

The best part is they did use humans, this bet was placed in person.

> The bettor, who identified himself to News 12 New Jersey as Anthony Prince, placed the wager over the counter at the sportsbook at the Meadowlands Racetrack

Re: FanDuel not honoring bet that would have paid over $82,000 due to line error

#39

Post by alehul »

lifeisstillgood wrote: post #17

>>> industry practice, which specifically address such obvious pricing errors. I am in two minds here. Firstly this is a "contract" - honour it. Secondly, I understand the industry practise, but Indont think it is in line with society needs - that is a human bookmaker would never have given 750-1 with the team leading and minutes to go. So either you write software that won't do that and take the risk, or you stop us…

Well put.

Finance has seen its fair share of this. As an example, I was ashamed to see the difference in reactions between when it was Knight Capital [0] vs Goldman Sachs [1].

For Knight Capital, the entire company floundered after a trading glitch, and they closed shortly after.

When it was Goldman who suffered a glitch, many of their trades "qualified for cancellation". Co-author of the Black Scholes formula even spoke up against this hypocrisy.

Both companies lobbied to the exchanges and the SEC, but one had more capital. If this is any indicator, a company like FanDuel may be let off.

[0] https://dealbook.nytimes.com/2012/08/02/knight-capital-says-... [1] https://www.ft.com/content/37fff9c6-0b36-11e3-bffc-00144feab...

Re: FanDuel not honoring bet that would have paid over $82,000 due to line error

#40

Post by xae342 »

I feel like we need the Second Software Crisis movement to address the bug riddled software were still making, it’s as though we’re just acclimated to bugs everywhere as being expected. Perhaps in 2100 they’ll look back on this time in software as we do on the early automotive industry today.
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