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Ask HN: Why are there no public social networks?

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Re: Ask HN: Why are there no public social networks?

#31
There are government run (even if by proxy) social networks. The are worse that Facebook.

https://vk.com/ is government run.

The Chinese "Credit Score" is run by Alibaba and Tencent, which run all the social networks in China and therefore have access to a vast amount of data about people’s social ties and activities and what they say. In addition to measuring your ability to pay, as in the United States, the scores serve as a measure of political compliance. Among the things that will hurt a citizen’s score are posting political opinions without prior permission, or posting information that the regime does not like.

There are plenty more too. Just hope the US doesn't make a government-run social network.

Re: Ask HN: Why are there no public social networks?

#33
Interesting question, and one that opens up numerous areas of history, communications, community, control, freedom, and public vs. private operation.

In the United States, the postal service from its beginning was publicly operated, and served specifically to distribute timely information and general knowledge in the form of discounted rates for newspapers, magazines, and books, as well as providing personal correspondence and parcel delivery. It also established principles of privacy to correspondents.

This was in contrast to various earlier systems, either privately operated or, frequently, operated as part of royal intelligence services.

With the emergence of telephony and broadcast technologies, there were numerous national debates throughout the worrld over public vs. private operation, with many countries opting for primarily public systems. The U.S. chose instead, generally, a regulated private approach.

There are a few histories of these developments, though fewer than you might think. University of Illinois media scholar Roberrt W. McChesney has several books on the topic.

Several countries leveraged their national telecoms systems to create early computer networks, most notably France's Minitel. In the US, the early DARPANET, ARPANET, and Internet were largely public operations, though through a mixed-control operator network, including the Department of Defence, RAND, SRI, the National Science Foundation, and numerous universities, themselves a mix of public and private.

The Internet itself gradually transitioned from research to commercial use between 1985 and 1995, in a not particularly structured manner. See for example: https://groups.csail.mit.edu/mac/classes/6.805/student-paper...

There remain elements of government involvement and access to both Net infrastructure and firms, including investments in several significant firms (notably Google and Facebook), as well as intercept capabilities through network operators, engineered device and protocol weaknesses, CA compromises, and both law-based and extralegal means, fairly trivially confirmed through a few moments research. (EFF and The Intercept document much of this.)

At the same time, there are countries which do substantively operate or participate in social networks either directly or through public-private enterprises, notably Russia and China.

And much of the objective of networking the world has been accomplished through largely private operators.

In short: they could, some do, there's a great deal of history, and the present regime arose likely in significant part as national governments and agencies thought they were seeing their needs met through the cooptable efforts of others.

Re: Ask HN: Why are there no public social networks?

#34

Have you ever used a government website? With the exception on gov.uk, they are all god-awful. I suspect lack of talent within the government is one major reason.

I think a more likely answer is a lot of successful lobbying by large crappy software companies. See also Oracle.

Re: Ask HN: Why are there no public social networks?

#35

You need roads, bridges, water, electricity, and garbage collection to fulfill basic physiological needs, and also so you can swap menial tasks for higher level work/spending time with family/enjoying a better standard of living. Framing in Maslow's pyramid [1]: Many of the goods/services the gov provides fulfill either level 1 physiological needs or level 2 security needs. Social networks fulfill level 3 and 4 needs…

People will choose communications over very nearly all other services. Author and historian Shelby Foote makes note of this in his anthology Jefferson County, observing homes wired for telephone service before they had electricity, circa 1910.

Re: Ask HN: Why are there no public social networks?

#36
post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The meme that (all) government is terrible at technology is getting tired. It is not necessarily true that a publicly run system will inevitably be crap/inefficient/archaic. A good example is the British gov.uk group, who have made some well thought out, usable and technologically sound systems. Please stop perpetuating this lie. You can, and should expect better of your public digital systems. Don't let them use "Pu…

What happens in a country 1/5 the size in population and 1/10 the size economically shouldnt be expected to perform the same on something literally 10x bigger. You likely are much closer to your political representatives than we are. The amount of money flowing into your politicians pockets are less. Here I expect the government contract to be unfavorable to the population at large. I expect the leading politicians t…

USDS and 18F are staffed by confident people from industry. The federal government, when it comes to software, is not as incompetent as you think.

Re: Ask HN: Why are there no public social networks?

#38

Not sure why you are being downvoted as this is a very interesting question indeed. Social networks tend to kill each other due to network effects as people are flocking to the most used network since there's the largest value for everyone. So having multiple networks might not really work well. It wouldn't have to be several networks though and it doesn't even have to be your own government running it to provide the…

Simply trying to gain traction is hard. Most attempts fail.

Re: Ask HN: Why are there no public social networks?

#39

You need roads, bridges, water, electricity, and garbage collection to fulfill basic physiological needs, and also so you can swap menial tasks for higher level work/spending time with family/enjoying a better standard of living. Framing in Maslow's pyramid [1]: Many of the goods/services the gov provides fulfill either level 1 physiological needs or level 2 security needs. Social networks fulfill level 3 and 4 needs…

Social networks fulfill all needs. That is why the ultimate form of punishment in our society is to isolate the individual from all human contact. Humans do terribly in an environment without other people. Why does it matter that the medium is digital?

> That is why the ultimate form of punishment in our society is to isolate the individual from all human contact.

I would've thought the ultimate form of punishment is execution. If you were talking about life in prison however, I think the reason is to keep the other people safe, not to inflict psychological pain on the convicted.

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