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Instructions from Facebook not to touch the posts of the cabinet minister

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Re: Instructions from Facebook not to touch the posts of the cabinet minister

#31

Post by nhfoiwehf »

18pfsmt wrote: post #24
Eochei5h wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Selective choice of inaction and complaints about that all play into the same tune, that facebook is the one doing the policing (sometimes). That's the root problem. If facebook were not the ultimate arbiter this article wouldn't have to exist in the first place.

>If facebook were not the ultimate arbiter If people would stop using FB, rather than complaining about it, perhaps this would not be an issue?

If we don't complain about Facebook, how are the people still on it going to know all the reasons they should leave?

Re: Instructions from Facebook not to touch the posts of the cabinet minister

#32

Post by watwat1 »

TimMurnaghan wrote: post #25
nhanq wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I see. I have a female friend in Vienna, she's said similar stuff to me. Things are getting bad there.

Funny how it's just become the first european city to top the economist liveability index. https://www.bbc.com/news/business-45174600

Funny how the stories from citizens and your fake news differ so much.

Re: Instructions from Facebook not to touch the posts of the cabinet minister

#33

Post by wallace_f »

Eochei5h wrote: post #29
18pfsmt wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>If facebook were not the ultimate arbiter If people would stop using FB, rather than complaining about it, perhaps this would not be an issue?

If you know how to solve the network effect that would be great. Otherwise we might just end up trading one master for another.

Plenty of things have been popular and then gone out of style.

Perhaps the answer is to make the concept of social networks no longer cool; or even make them undesirable. I think it's pretty clear they are not, anyways.

I use whatsapp, line, email and photo sharing services that allow me to easily share and communicate thoughts and media with exactly who I want. It's more personal, not addictive, creates better relationships, and helps me focus more on who I am rather than how others perceive me. And of course I don't have to use facebook and be a part of all its oft-criticized problems.

Re: Instructions from Facebook not to touch the posts of the cabinet minister

#34

Post by ashelmire »

The trouble lies in two places:

"When there is false information but the the poster is not trying to mislead anyone, that's just someone on the internet being wrong, and there is no Facebook policy against it."

In and of itself, being wrong is not a problem. You can be thwarted by debate and evidence. However, it's much easier to spread a lie than to effectively repute one, so this gets out of hand very quickly.

"This is why Facebook concentrates most of its efforts on the last category, when someone spreads lies with the explicit intention to mislead."

The trouble is that most of the second category is actually the third category. Just because the lies are coming from random people, your uncle Joe, or some innocent organization sowing dissent in the US and secretly run by a Russian, and just because they don't say, "This is what you should believe so that the world can be run by neofascist forces", doesn't mean that the intent isn't to mislead. Any attempt to spread lies and falsehoods via the common viral video or meme styles IS an attempt to willfully spread lies. To assume that much of this isn't willful is naive.

Leaving it to Facebook to decide what's intended to mislead has not been working. The solution is not to trust anything you see on Facebook or to leave the platform entirely.

Re: Instructions from Facebook not to touch the posts of the cabinet minister

#35

Post by macintux »

ashelmire wrote: post #34

The trouble lies in two places: "When there is false information but the the poster is not trying to mislead anyone, that's just someone on the internet being wrong, and there is no Facebook policy against it." In and of itself, being wrong is not a problem. You can be thwarted by debate and evidence. However, it's much easier to spread a lie than to effectively repute one, so this gets out of hand very quickly. "Thi…

> The solution is not to trust anything you see on Facebook or to leave the platform entirely.

Unfortunately neither does much good individually, because the real harm comes from the widespread acceptance of the lies.

Re: Instructions from Facebook not to touch the posts of the cabinet minister

#36

Post by pixl97 »

danijelb wrote: post #26
radiator wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hungary is a sovereign country. Why would a government have any obligations towards any medium, to allow it to operate within the country? Esp. when said medium has an agenda to influence public opinion? (In this case, by taking down videos expressing the opinion of the democratically elected government, and by only allowing videos criticising the opinion of the majority of the citizens). Governments can decide what…

You are absolutely right. Hungary is a sovereign country. If they don't like their citizens having access to a particular private platform/medium, they can block access to it. It's very simple. The same way it's done with everything else. If a country doesn't like a particular book, they ban imports into their territory. If they don't like their citizens having ability to catch a TV/radio transmission from a neighbor…

>But once a country decides to do such things, they can no longer be considered a democracy.

Shit, the US isn't a democracy? I don't think this is how any of this works.

Re: Instructions from Facebook not to touch the posts of the cabinet minister

#37

Post by gt_ »

danijelb wrote: post #10
Eochei5h wrote: post #4

The whole concept of "community standards" for a worldwide communication channel strikes me as newspeak for centralized moral policing. Imagine the leading social network weren't facebook but vkontakte or weibo and they imposed their own standards on billions of people communicating with each other. Filtering should be a tool available to individuals and delegatable to groups that are aligned with their own standards…

But Facebook is not a worldwide communication channel. It's a social network/community owned by a single company and its shareholders. Internet is the worldwide communication channel. You can "filter" it and make sure it aligns with your own standards by simply choosing to visit and use websites, communities and services which do align with your standards, and by avoiding those which don't align.

What if your own government uses Facebook to communicate with it’s populace?

(For example, this)

Are you recommending everyone just stop participating in politics? I can’t imagine a more sheltered perspective. I’m guessing you’re an American. If so, please, stop following this advice! The rest of the world is begging you.

Re: Instructions from Facebook not to touch the posts of the cabinet minister

#38

Post by Someguywhatever »

macintux wrote: post #35
ashelmire wrote: post #34

The trouble lies in two places: "When there is false information but the the poster is not trying to mislead anyone, that's just someone on the internet being wrong, and there is no Facebook policy against it." In and of itself, being wrong is not a problem. You can be thwarted by debate and evidence. However, it's much easier to spread a lie than to effectively repute one, so this gets out of hand very quickly. "Thi…

> The solution is not to trust anything you see on Facebook or to leave the platform entirely. Unfortunately neither does much good individually, because the real harm comes from the widespread acceptance of the lies.

Who gets to decide what are lies?

Makes me think of this saying: "In the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is king."

Re: Instructions from Facebook not to touch the posts of the cabinet minister

#39

Post by tomp »

jancsika wrote: post #16
Eochei5h wrote: post #4

The whole concept of "community standards" for a worldwide communication channel strikes me as newspeak for centralized moral policing. Imagine the leading social network weren't facebook but vkontakte or weibo and they imposed their own standards on billions of people communicating with each other. Filtering should be a tool available to individuals and delegatable to groups that are aligned with their own standards…

> The whole concept of "community standards" for a worldwide communication channel strikes me as newspeak for centralized moral policing. Moral policing? This article is about the opposite -- Facebook telling its "moral police" not to moderate posts from pro-government posters. The article also features a claim that someone at Facebook guided pro-government posters in the government to use dog whistles to get around…

Only after being pressured by the government. The problem is that the pressure needed to be applied in the first place. “Weak” people (i.e. those not backed by powerful organisations) have no recourse.

Re: Instructions from Facebook not to touch the posts of the cabinet minister

#40

Post by CapacitorSet »

jancsika wrote: post #16
Eochei5h wrote: post #4

The whole concept of "community standards" for a worldwide communication channel strikes me as newspeak for centralized moral policing. Imagine the leading social network weren't facebook but vkontakte or weibo and they imposed their own standards on billions of people communicating with each other. Filtering should be a tool available to individuals and delegatable to groups that are aligned with their own standards…

> The whole concept of "community standards" for a worldwide communication channel strikes me as newspeak for centralized moral policing. Moral policing? This article is about the opposite -- Facebook telling its "moral police" not to moderate posts from pro-government posters. The article also features a claim that someone at Facebook guided pro-government posters in the government to use dog whistles to get around…

They're imposing Facebook's moral indeed: racism is bad, but not if it's from a famous person that makes your social network relevant.
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