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A new digital divide: Young people who can’t use keyboards

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Re: A new digital divide: Young people who can’t use keyboards

#31

Post by mikebelanger »

FactolSarin wrote: post #11
sexydefinesher wrote: post #8

Cant say i feel sorry for the people who chose to be enslaved to interfaces. Information technology will continue to expand into human life more and more, whether you are prepared or not.

In my experience with kids, it's not a choice. It's mostly poor kids who have this problem. Their family doesn't have a PC, and an old/cheap smartphone is the way they access the Internet.

Yeah definitely. A phone is considered much more necessary for basic functioning in a modern society - whereas the computer is a little 'extra'. Naturally poorer people only invest in the more basic, cheaper thing.

I believe projects like Raspberry Pi were attempts to mitigate this issue too. Hopefully they gain more traction in society at large.

Re: A new digital divide: Young people who can’t use keyboards

#32

Post by imron »

> Young people who can’t use keyboards

How is this different from previous generations?

The examples listed (not knowing how to use a keyboard, not knowing how to double click and not knowing what a 'cell' in a spreadsheet is) were all extremely common among my classmates back in highschool (and this is talking about the 90's here, so computers were in fairly widespread use at this point).

The new digital divide is just like the old one.

Re: A new digital divide: Young people who can’t use keyboards

#33

Post by 21 »

codingdave wrote: post #26
21 wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I've seen children accustomed to using touch interfaces blurring the line between physical and virtual, i.e swiping at physical objects like books, photos, even walls. I've not seen this behavior with those used to non touch interfaces. Why do you think this is a bad think? This is how kids learn how the world works, by trying the same thing in different contexts, like how small children put everything in their mou…

It depends on the age of the child. A toddler who is still exploring the world is one thing. A 14 year old who swipes at a book is a problem. (I don't know the age of the children from these anecdotes.) On the other hand, a toddler who explores the world as if it is a touch screen has been given way too much time on a touch screen. So there is definitely a problem there.

> On the other hand, a toddler who explores the world as if it is a touch screen has been given way too much time on a touch screen. So there is definitely a problem there.

You are making quite an assumption here. People of many centuries ago would also say that we raise our kids in a wrong way, because we don't teach them how to survive in the wild or how to work a potato field.

Re: A new digital divide: Young people who can’t use keyboards

#34

Post by ximeng »

nickserv wrote: post #9

Do your children a favor and get them a "real" computer with keyboard and mouse, instead of a tablet. I've found it helps with several things. For one, I've seen children accustomed to using touch interfaces blurring the line between physical and virtual, i.e swiping at physical objects like books, photos, even walls. I've not seen this behavior with those used to non touch interfaces. Also, learning to use a keyboar…

I've absentmindedly pinched to zoom on books and occasionally mentally ctrl+z when I screw up. Not a major problem.

Re: A new digital divide: Young people who can’t use keyboards

#36

Post by euske »

I've seen this claim over and over, and failed to see how this is a big deal. Most people in Japan in 80s couldn't type either. (An English typewriter wasn't something that most people would use or own.) Even if kids can't type, I bet they would learn typing faster than the kids 30 years ago. Sounds like a fuss about nothing.

Re: A new digital divide: Young people who can’t use keyboards

#37

Post by megaman22 »

strken wrote: post #15
SQL2219 wrote: post #2

This is similar to the stereotype of: young people are good with computers. Browsing Instagram is not the same as creating value through programming and complex problem solving.

I've always felt that young people are seen as good with computers because they're more confident and less afraid of failure, and that even if their only experience is instagram they're more likely to google a scary error message or click around at random in various menus.

I'm not sure that that is the case, any longer. I have a lot of trouble with our college-aged interns, because they will barely make an effort to try doing something before getting stonewalled and bailing out to go ask someone to do it for them. Sometimes I just want to yell at them to run the code and see what happens, and then try to figure out why what happened happened. And these are computer science majors.

Re: A new digital divide: Young people who can’t use keyboards

#38

Post by Tomte »

codingdave wrote: post #26
21 wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I've seen children accustomed to using touch interfaces blurring the line between physical and virtual, i.e swiping at physical objects like books, photos, even walls. I've not seen this behavior with those used to non touch interfaces. Why do you think this is a bad think? This is how kids learn how the world works, by trying the same thing in different contexts, like how small children put everything in their mou…

It depends on the age of the child. A toddler who is still exploring the world is one thing. A 14 year old who swipes at a book is a problem. (I don't know the age of the children from these anecdotes.) On the other hand, a toddler who explores the world as if it is a touch screen has been given way too much time on a touch screen. So there is definitely a problem there.

I have swiped on books several times now. Just a temporary lapse, I laugh about it and a few years later it may happen again.

Re: A new digital divide: Young people who can’t use keyboards

#39

Post by mikebelanger »

bachbach wrote: post #14
acct1771 wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Less literate in terms of creating anything .

I agree and I'm in this group. I blame the duration of modern education. It has made newer generations less flexible. Institutionalization. It's a paradox because the Internet has made the pollination of ideas more likely - but we are less likely to do new things, we stay in our boxes. This shows up in the productivity and entrepreneurship statistics. It may be true that wages are poor and rents are high - but also w…

Part of the reason for the decline in self-built in homes is advancements in modular home building. They're much better, and more economical than ever before. Even my Dad, who self-built two large homes himself, admitted it doesn't make sense to self-build. One is better off just working more in whatever specialty they do, and getting a modular home.

Re: A new digital divide: Young people who can’t use keyboards

#40

Post by wallflower »

Having volunteered to teach kids coming from single-parent household with no computer at home, I've seen how the inability to type on a QWERTY keyboard with any modicum of speed (hunt-and-peck) actually limits them when we encourage them to 'iterate', 'try fast and fail', 'just code a line of something', or 'what will that do?'. If expressing your thoughts and intentions to the editor is painful and slow, it is a concrete barrier to learning how to fail faster.

Forgot teaching kids how to code right away , teach them how to type first so they can "commune" with the machine (ideally with ergonomics and whole arm movement in mind so RSI is not an issue).

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