Live data from Hacker News

The Pentagon Is Building a Team of Tech-Savvy Soldiers

wired.com

31–40 of 66 posts

Re: The Pentagon Is Building a Team of Tech-Savvy Soldiers

#31
post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I work for federal government. And the government subsidies my pay @ $4500 to live in DC. I’m humbled by my opportunity to be in the public service. I’ve turned down valley jobs. US gov is filled with highly qualified people. You just don’t know their twitter.

DC itself has a pretty bad government COL adjustment because it is the average of an area comprising some much lower COL areas in Pennsylvania and West Virginia. For example, a GS employee who works in Downtown DC where a 1 BR apartment will go for $2500 / month will get paid the exact same amount as his / her peer working in Hampshire, WV. The same apartment there is about $700. * https://www.federalpay.org/gs/local…

There is local pay adjustment. For Federal Judges or political positions these are set by congress across the board so this is accurate.

Re: The Pentagon Is Building a Team of Tech-Savvy Soldiers

#32
post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I work for federal government. And the government subsidies my pay @ $4500 to live in DC. I’m humbled by my opportunity to be in the public service. I’ve turned down valley jobs. US gov is filled with highly qualified people. You just don’t know their twitter.

They add $4500 per month to live in DC?

You ready to join the force?

Re: The Pentagon Is Building a Team of Tech-Savvy Soldiers

#33

As someone who works for the Defense Department I found this article totally unsurprising. This sort of story is common. The question people should be asking is why does it take a 3-star general's blessing in order to get a team functioning computers that are usable for something besides Email and Microsoft Office. Another major obstacle that isn't touched on in this article is buying things. Typical timeline for pur…

I think this article does a wonderful job explaining why the military is built the way it is:

https://www.joelonsoftware.com/2006/08/08/the-command-and-co...

If Command and Control is such a bad way to run a team, why does the military use it?

This was explained to me in NCO school. I was in the Israeli paratroopers in 1986. Probably the worst paratrooper they ever had, now that I think back.

There are several standing orders for soldiers. Number one: if you are in a mine field, freeze. Makes sense, right? It was drilled into you repeatedly during basic training. Every once in a while the instructor would shout out “Mine!” and everybody had to freeze just so you would get in the habit.

Standing order number two: when attacked, run towards your attackers while shooting. The shooting makes them take cover so they can’t fire at you. Running towards them causes you to get closer to them, which makes it easier to aim at them, which makes it easier to kill them. This standing order makes a lot of sense, too.

OK, now for the Interview Question. What do you do if you’re in a minefield, and people start shooting at you?

This is not such a hypothetical situation; it’s a really annoying way to get caught in an ambush.

The correct answer, it turns out, is that you ignore the minefield, and run towards the attackers while shooting.

The rationale behind this is that if you freeze, they’ll pick you off one at a time until you’re all dead, but if you charge, only some of you will die by running over mines, so for the greater good, that’s what you have to do.

The trouble is that no rational soldier would charge under such circumstances. Each individual soldier has an enormous incentive to cheat: freeze in place and let the other, more macho soldiers do the charging. It’s sort of like a Prisoners’ Dilemma.

In life or death situations, the military needs to make sure that they can shout orders and soldiers will obey them even if the orders are suicidal. That means soldiers need to be programmed to be obedient in a way which is not really all that important for, say, a software company.

You need a 3 star general's blessing to get computers because the whole military is built around authoritarianism and slavish obedience. It is built on those things because, in war, they are necessary. This has an unfortunate knock-on effect of making every decision take way too long and severely limits the autonomy of everyone in the chain of command, in often ridiculous ways. But if it comes down to being better at developing new tech, and winning a war, the army clearly has priority on the later rather than the former.

Re: The Pentagon Is Building a Team of Tech-Savvy Soldiers

#34
post #25

Never understood the underpaying of highly qualified people in the govt. Making a sacrifice for your country in a high powered / representative position is one thing, but the rank and file? Billions are spent on defense contracts and old software, but when bringing on teams of people to revamp the system, they want these people to take more than a 50% pay cut. D.C. is an expensive place to live as well. If you think…

>Never understood the underpaying of highly qualified people in the govt. because Americans have been trained get upset when they find how much government employees make and that's why their taxes are so "high".

It's not only the pay but the immense cronyism* that goes into landing a government position and the general poor quality of customer service in face to face roles coughDMVcough. coughPublicTransitcough. CoughVirtuallyAllPublicEduxationcough.

Add to that the standard arrogance, throughout the ages, of agents of Imperial power and you might start to understand why Americans have such a strong antipathy towards government workers.

* - from personal experience being jerked around for 6 months (for a ing file clerk position). And wouldn't you know it. At the end, after the interviewers reassured me I was a likely hire, one of the interviewer's cousins got the position. Hmmm....

Re: The Pentagon Is Building a Team of Tech-Savvy Soldiers

#36

As someone who works for the Defense Department I found this article totally unsurprising. This sort of story is common. The question people should be asking is why does it take a 3-star general's blessing in order to get a team functioning computers that are usable for something besides Email and Microsoft Office. Another major obstacle that isn't touched on in this article is buying things. Typical timeline for pur…

I think this article does a wonderful job explaining why the military is built the way it is: https://www.joelonsoftware.com/2006/08/08/the-command-and-co... If Command and Control is such a bad way to run a team, why does the military use it? This was explained to me in NCO school. I was in the Israeli paratroopers in 1986. Probably the worst paratrooper they ever had, now that I think back. There are several standi…

> This has an unfortunate knock-on effect of making every decision take way too long and severely limits the autonomy of everyone in the chain of command, in often ridiculous ways.

Not necessarily:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mission-type_tactics

Re: The Pentagon Is Building a Team of Tech-Savvy Soldiers

#37

Never understood the underpaying of highly qualified people in the govt. Making a sacrifice for your country in a high powered / representative position is one thing, but the rank and file? Billions are spent on defense contracts and old software, but when bringing on teams of people to revamp the system, they want these people to take more than a 50% pay cut. D.C. is an expensive place to live as well. If you think…

Eh, look at it as a filter for true believers. Mercenaries are dangerous, because they have a price.

Or you get mercenaries anyway, that are looking to profit from something else than the salary (ie, corruption).

Re: The Pentagon Is Building a Team of Tech-Savvy Soldiers

#38
post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Eh, look at it as a filter for true believers. Mercenaries are dangerous, because they have a price.

Perhaps a better analogy: let's say you're hiring people with the offer that you'll pay them $2M the first year, then nothing for 20 years. The danger is that the person will quit. So it is more conservative to offer a deal where you pay them nothing for 20 years, then $2M. Then you're pretty sure they'll stay, especially if they're 15 years in. I think that's probably the best way to understand the salary/pension tr…

This system doesn’t work at all if people believe pensions are being cut.

Re: The Pentagon Is Building a Team of Tech-Savvy Soldiers

#39

As someone who works for the Defense Department I found this article totally unsurprising. This sort of story is common. The question people should be asking is why does it take a 3-star general's blessing in order to get a team functioning computers that are usable for something besides Email and Microsoft Office. Another major obstacle that isn't touched on in this article is buying things. Typical timeline for pur…

I think this article does a wonderful job explaining why the military is built the way it is: https://www.joelonsoftware.com/2006/08/08/the-command-and-co... If Command and Control is such a bad way to run a team, why does the military use it? This was explained to me in NCO school. I was in the Israeli paratroopers in 1986. Probably the worst paratrooper they ever had, now that I think back. There are several standi…

> the whole military is built around authoritarianism and slavish obedience

This is a huge misconception people have about the military. In fact the core philosophy of command in western militaries is one of enabling people to make their own independent decisions. The military wants nothing less than non-thinking obedient slaves because they know that’s how wars are lost.

Re: The Pentagon Is Building a Team of Tech-Savvy Soldiers

#40
post #25

Never understood the underpaying of highly qualified people in the govt. Making a sacrifice for your country in a high powered / representative position is one thing, but the rank and file? Billions are spent on defense contracts and old software, but when bringing on teams of people to revamp the system, they want these people to take more than a 50% pay cut. D.C. is an expensive place to live as well. If you think…

>Never understood the underpaying of highly qualified people in the govt. because Americans have been trained get upset when they find how much government employees make and that's why their taxes are so "high".

is it related to the term "public servants"?

or stories about gov. employees doing nothing but getting paid?

Post reply on HN