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Why China doesn’t dominate soccer

washingtonpost.com

31–40 of 112 posts

Re: Why China doesn’t dominate soccer

#31
Parallel to the article's argument, I'd argue football (soccer) unpredictability are due to size and diversity in almost all it's aspects: most number of fans/aspiring players, also inherently (culturally) most diverse set of potential players/strategies and leagues organization.

At the regional scale, those also tend to be the most competitive and popular leagues, enabling breeding grounds of diverse playing styles. There's diversity even in how those leagues are managed and organized.

Compared to popular US sports franchises, which according to the article and my understanding (non-american), football(soccer) leagues around the world are much less centralized.

I don't know about China now, but growing up in Asia in 90s I'd say it is hard to foster the type of rivalry/diversity/competition needed to adapt to football(soccer).

Re: Why China doesn’t dominate soccer

#33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Which sports is the author referring to other than American Football? I mean this pretty clearly refers to Baseball as well.

Almost the only play planning in baseball is the catcher calling pitches. Everything else is reaction to where the ball goes. The coach does staffing.

The manager (the head of a baseball team is the manager, not the coach, for whatever reason) is also responsible for putting on the shift, telling the batter to bunt, calling for stolen base attempts, and other strategic things along those lines.

Re: Why China doesn’t dominate soccer

#35
post #3

Seems pretty weak and unsupported. It can be summed up as "China doesn't excel at soccer because of authoritarianism and because the sport is not well understood by anyone and central planning doesn't help". Ok, if you say so. Where's the evidence?

> China doesn't excel at soccer because of authoritarianism and because the sport is not well understood by anyone and central planning doesn't help

It's hard not to be mean to someone who calls it soccer :-), but this betrays an obvious lack of familiarity with the history of this sport.

USSR, Czechoslovakia and Yugoslavia all had very strong national teams, pretty much until they were dissolved. Clubs from the communist bloc did not dominate football, but put very convincing performances and were routinely represented in the higher stages of European competitions. Red Star Belgrade and Steaua Bucharest won the Champions Cup within a few years of each other -- all this while players trained in sub-par conditions, worked with sub-par equipment, had access to sub-par medical conditions, research and treatment, and were usually unable to play abroad and further their career at the truly major European clubs.

If anything, the quality of football in most ex-communist countries, Russia included, has steadily declined. Poland and Croatia are the only major and steady exceptions (Ukraine, the Czech Republic and Romania enjoyed some brief stints but not much else), and it's probably no coincidence that their national economies are faring better than those of most ex-communist countries.

Re: Why China doesn’t dominate soccer

#36
post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cricket is not the most popular sport of those countries. Football is.

I think you may have misinterpreted zhdc1's point. I think they mean to say that if Brazilians and Nigerians have a cultural preference for football, why attempt to force cricket onto them?

Agreed, and also that population size and economic power aren't always the end all-be alls for success.

The US has a great women's team in part because lots of women play soccer, and in part because their aren't that many other competitive sports for them to play on a professional level.

The US has an OK men's team mainly because there are enough athletes left over after football, basketball, baseball, and hockey take their cuts to field a somewhat competitive team. They didn't qualify this time around, but they have qualified for seven of the last eight World Cups, so they're doing something right.

In both cases, it has little to do with how much money is spent (if that were the case, the US would dominate the sport) and more to do with how many top athletes decide to play the sport with kids AND stick with it as a profession once they become adults.

Re: Why China doesn’t dominate soccer

#37
There is a better explanation.

Being talented individual is not enough. They have to play against other equally talented individuals in the highest level professional leagues from the age of 18 to develop tactically and technically. China needs a professional soccer league with top level foreigners or they need to send their best to European leagues. They can do it but it can take several generations.

Soccer is the most popular sport in the world and has most professional athletes by far. Best individuals from all over the world go to play in best professional teams, mostly in Europe and they continue to grow with better opponents and teammates. Talented Brazilians playing in top leagues all over the world a bring all that with them to their national team. Iceland (population little over 300,000) has professional players playing in England, Russia, Sweden, Netherlands ...

Re: Why China doesn’t dominate soccer

#38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Which sports is the author referring to other than American Football? I mean this pretty clearly refers to Baseball as well.

Almost the only play planning in baseball is the catcher calling pitches. Everything else is reaction to where the ball goes. The coach does staffing.

This. I was never a huge baseball fan, but my sons got into it, and observing beyond the surface it is really impressive how many split-second intelligent decisions you have to make in baseball, with (again) quick ad hoc coordination.

Re: Why China doesn’t dominate soccer

#39
China plays the US for the gold medal in Olympic BEACH VOLLEYBALL. They can dominate anything they want, they just haven’t invested the effort and money into soccer yet. There are more popular sports in China like basketball which they will go after first.

Re: Why China doesn’t dominate soccer

#40

While I think things like vision, communication and teamwork, spatial awareness and improvisational ability are critically important and can't be taught (though they can be learned through lots of play), this article definitely shortchanges the amount of physical and technical skills required for soccer / football that can be taught and developed through practice Good stamina is a prerequisite for being good at socce…

So if you look at a distribution of folks possessing the attributes required of a footballer, you can be fairly competitive amongst the general population with one or two, but the long tail of elite players requires all seven of the attributes you mention.

you'll be better than most players up to probably a US division 3 college level

If you really love the game, this sounds like a fairly satisfying career peak. A reasonably healthy player should take comfort in knowing it's achievable through effort alone.

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