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Inside Tesla’s Model 3 Factory

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Re: Inside Tesla’s Model 3 Factory

#31

Post by izacus »

1024core wrote: post #12
kjksf wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are some on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AVCCroN7vS0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8_lfxPI5ObM And one with more than just factory: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KA18tusTgE4

The first 2 videos are from 2015 and 2013, respectively. I'm guessing things have changed a bit since then?

Tesla S didn't really change since then, why do you expect a huge manufacturing plant to change drastically? It's not like you just throw all robots and conveyor belts in a bin like an iPhone. Car industry is on significantly longer cycles.

Re: Inside Tesla’s Model 3 Factory

#32

Post by rconti »

A few random comments, having toured a few auto plants and watched plenty of videos:

* I'm surprised to hear Tesla is using robots to install seats. This isn't common, from what I've seen.

* I toured the Tesla factory back in October, perhaps a month after touring BMW in Munich. Tesla was vastly less automated than BMW, for better or for worse. So I take the whole "Tesla is automating EVERYTHING!" with a grain of salt.

* It's not uncommon for cars to have the seatbelt integrated into the seat itself. Particularly with convertibles.

* A lot of this reads like a puff piece.

Re: Inside Tesla’s Model 3 Factory

#33

Post by bgorman »

The thing that stands out to me here is that Tesla has wasted a ton of time and money building up competency in commodity features. No consumer considers Tesla Seats to be the differentiating factor. Why on earth didn't Tesla just decide to use a more conventional seat design and outsource the work to a Seat supplier like all other car manufacturers. Kind of reminds me of Software Engineers that always want to roll their own implementation of everything... They get less done and are overconfident in their own abilities.

Re: Inside Tesla’s Model 3 Factory

#34

Post by niyazpk »

izacus wrote: post #31
1024core wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The first 2 videos are from 2015 and 2013, respectively. I'm guessing things have changed a bit since then?

Tesla S didn't really change since then, why do you expect a huge manufacturing plant to change drastically? It's not like you just throw all robots and conveyor belts in a bin like an iPhone. Car industry is on significantly longer cycles.

Elon said[1] in the shareholder meeting that the Model S has changed significantly from the older versions. I don't know the differences myself, so take it FWIW.

[1] https://www.tesla.com/shareholdermeeting at around 01:16:00

Re: Inside Tesla’s Model 3 Factory

#35

Post by adventured »

bgorman wrote: post #33

The thing that stands out to me here is that Tesla has wasted a ton of time and money building up competency in commodity features. No consumer considers Tesla Seats to be the differentiating factor. Why on earth didn't Tesla just decide to use a more conventional seat design and outsource the work to a Seat supplier like all other car manufacturers. Kind of reminds me of Software Engineers that always want to roll t…

It's because Musk is a micro-manager that is easily frustrated by flaws in external solutions and more tolerant of even greater flaws internally. It's why he puts his nose into everything his companies do (eg in the article it mentions he had a role in designing the extruded aluminum base of the Model X seat, which is absurd).

Re: Inside Tesla’s Model 3 Factory

#36

Post by danso »

rconti wrote: post #32

A few random comments, having toured a few auto plants and watched plenty of videos: * I'm surprised to hear Tesla is using robots to install seats. This isn't common, from what I've seen. * I toured the Tesla factory back in October, perhaps a month after touring BMW in Munich. Tesla was vastly less automated than BMW, for better or for worse. So I take the whole "Tesla is automating EVERYTHING!" with a grain of sal…

> So I take the whole "Tesla is automating EVERYTHING!" with a grain of salt.

FTA:

> Even so, Tesla says the Model 3 body line is now 95 percent automated, including the transfer, loading, and welding of parts.

Apparently, there's a big difference between the "body line" assembly and the rest of the line, as people in r/teslamotors have pointed out:

https://www.reddit.com/r/teslamotors/comments/8pim5q/inside_...

> When I was visiting the BMW plant in Munich a few years ago, they said the body line was automated 99%. It‘s really impressive, showed me that the real secret is not in the design of your car, but the design of your assembly line.

> But keep in mind that this is only the body line. The rest of the assembly process involves quite a bit more humans.

Re: Inside Tesla’s Model 3 Factory

#37

Post by kjksf »

bgorman wrote: post #33

The thing that stands out to me here is that Tesla has wasted a ton of time and money building up competency in commodity features. No consumer considers Tesla Seats to be the differentiating factor. Why on earth didn't Tesla just decide to use a more conventional seat design and outsource the work to a Seat supplier like all other car manufacturers. Kind of reminds me of Software Engineers that always want to roll t…

One possibility: that mindset of mediocrity doesn't produce excellence.

Apple, for example, is famous for caring about things that rationally they shouldn't care, like the insides of their computers.

And since history is written by victors and we apply post factum rationalization, no one says that Apple is wrong to care about details that are arguably irrelevant to the success.

The same will happen with Tesla.

If Tesla is successful then Musk will be a genius with uncompromising standard for quality.

If Tesla will fail then Musk will be an idiot whose hubris, micro-management and inability to prioritize doomed the company.

And reality is that neither you or me have enough information to judge this decision one way or another. You weren't there and the it was probably more complicated that what you assume based on zero data.

According to reports Tesla started doing seats in-house when a contractor that was supposedly an experienced seat maker failed to produce Model X seats which contributed to 18 month delay in delivering the car.

Re: Inside Tesla’s Model 3 Factory

#38

Post by cepth »

bgorman wrote: post #33

The thing that stands out to me here is that Tesla has wasted a ton of time and money building up competency in commodity features. No consumer considers Tesla Seats to be the differentiating factor. Why on earth didn't Tesla just decide to use a more conventional seat design and outsource the work to a Seat supplier like all other car manufacturers. Kind of reminds me of Software Engineers that always want to roll t…

There is probably a cost consideration here. Every additional layer of supplier means more and more margin goes to them.

I’d also imagine that if Tesla used the seat suppliers that the rest of the industry does, they’d get lower priority in terms of access to seat designers, engineers etc. A company doing 200k vehicles a year in sales, split across 3 models, doesn’t really have much buying/bargaining power.

When Musk visited Khan Academy for an interview some years ago, he mentioned that their USB cord supplier had shipped over defective cables, so they went to Fry’s to buy cables as a stopgap. I’d assume that kind of supply chain disruption is what they’re trying to avoid, for the more essential parts.

Re: Inside Tesla’s Model 3 Factory

#39

Post by solarkraft »

dmode wrote: post #17
jandrese wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Given how fast they were trying to ramp up production I wouldn't be surprised if they had to buy robots from multiple vendors becauase no single vendor was capable of building and installing the 2,000 robot arms he needed to hit that 5,000 car/week in 2 months target.

The bottleneck is not so much with robot manufacturers, but actually with the software implementation. There are software consultancies who will program the robot arms per Tesla specs.

With Tesla being focused on doing things in-house, shouldn't those be employees?
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