Tesla Plunges After a Conference Call • Hacker News Board

Re: Tesla Plunges After a Conference Call

#31

Post by tensor » Thu, May 03, 2018, 5:47 PM UTC

olivermarks wrote: post #20

Musk sounded exhausted. If Smith & Wesson launched a consumer flamethrower there would be outrage...Musk has been able to distract with lots of shiny objects but the clock is ticking, even amongst his niche fan base...I hope all the people who are working so hard in Musk's various companies come out of this ok...

For the sake of society, I hope Musk succeeds. We've spent too much time as a culture celebrating fairly useless achievements and being unwilling to dare to do the things that will truly take us forward.

Re: Tesla Plunges After a Conference Call

#32

Post by vkou » Thu, May 03, 2018, 5:48 PM UTC

Clubber wrote: post #11

Perhaps a buying opportunity. Sounds like investors are being spiteful.

Asking how he is going to reign in capital expenses, when their burn rate will drain them of cash in 8 months is not being spiteful.

It's called being an investor.

Refusing to answer that question, is either being spiteful, or disingenuous. It's a bit of a red flag.

Re: Tesla Plunges After a Conference Call

#33

Post by debt » Thu, May 03, 2018, 5:48 PM UTC

mephitix wrote: post #5

I was on this call. It was extremely cringey/embarrassing to hear Elon dismiss valid questions. At the same time, it was fantastic to see a young, smart, retail investor (Gali from Hyperchange) get to ask so many questions directly to the leadership team. I thought before the call that Gali would get to ask only one question, like the other analysts. He was able to ask almost 10! It was surreal. I was left feeling th…

Yeah I concur. The kind of numbers they're talking about are no joke.

Investors immediately responded to Elon's hubris in kind by severely punishing the stock. Seems the joke is on Musk.

Re: Tesla Plunges After a Conference Call

#34

Post by uryga » Thu, May 03, 2018, 5:49 PM UTC

jsw97 wrote: post #23

uryga wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Haven't read the paper, but isn't the causality the other way around? As in, troubled companies call on bullish analysts to try to keep up good appearances, but then underperform anyway because of their problems?

Yes, that's actually the causality they suggest in the paper.

Ah, thanks for the clarification!

Re: Tesla Plunges After a Conference Call

#35

Post by loceng » Thu, May 03, 2018, 5:49 PM UTC

namlem wrote: post #15

danso wrote: post #6

Is Musk still working long hours and sleeping at the car factory? Maybe he's a little under the effects of sleep deprivation.

Or he's just in a manic episode of his BPD.

Did he post anywhere that he has officially been diagnosed with BPD? I believe he said he had "bipolar" on Twitter at one point, though I remembered it seeming like he was referencing a cycle like mental exhaustion from heavy mental activity times to slower, more depressed states.

Re: Tesla Plunges After a Conference Call

#36

Post by thaumaturgy » Thu, May 03, 2018, 5:50 PM UTC

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #18

mephitix wrote: post #5

I was on this call. It was extremely cringey/embarrassing to hear Elon dismiss valid questions. At the same time, it was fantastic to see a young, smart, retail investor (Gali from Hyperchange) get to ask so many questions directly to the leadership team. I thought before the call that Gali would get to ask only one question, like the other analysts. He was able to ask almost 10! It was surreal. I was left feeling th…

"Sacconaghi pressed ahead with another query about Tesla lowering its 2018 capital expenditure projection to $3 billion, from $3.4 billion. Ahuja said the carmaker would spend less by simplifying its approach to automation and curtailing infrastructure outlays. 'And so where specifically will you be in terms of capital requirements?' Sacconaghi said. 'Excuse me. Next. Next,' Musk said to the call operator. 'Boring, b…

I'm not defending Elon's behavior here, but speaking more generally: if you're in a place where you need to maintain maximum productivity for a while, because a deadline has slipped for example, meetings can turn into a massive time sink if you don't act like a total nazi during them.

In so many meetings, people just want to hear themselves talk, whether to offer some opinion, reiterate some point, or ask some useless question. If your goal is, "end this meeting as quickly as possible so I can start fixing the things that need fixing", often the other people in the meeting become your careless adversaries.

edit: I regret trying to raise this point in a thread about Elon Musk. :-(

Re: Tesla Plunges After a Conference Call

#37

Post by karpodiem » Thu, May 03, 2018, 5:50 PM UTC

mephitix wrote: post #17

bjl wrote: post #13

Felt very reminiscent to Skilling's infamous earnings call. I'd have to imagine any TSLA investors are very concerned after that performance.

I’m not too worried. The earnings themselves were better than expected. Elon said this in a tweet but its reiterated in the earnings - projecting positive cash flow in Q3 and Q4. And such dismissive behavior (as much as I am not a fan of it) is not uncommon among stressed-out CEOs - Jobs, Gates..

Sorry, he's a day late a few billion dollars short for being lent trust on actually being cash flow positive in Q3.

Musk's history of lies - https://twitter.com/wolfejosh/status/989258303640408071

It's far more likely that the stock continues to deteriorate, and that there's a margin call at the $230 level (https://seekingalpha.com/article/4168224-musks-personal-fina...) and that Tesla is liquidated by the end of the year.

Re: Tesla Plunges After a Conference Call

#38

Post by arkis22 » Thu, May 03, 2018, 5:50 PM UTC

mephitix wrote: post #5

I was on this call. It was extremely cringey/embarrassing to hear Elon dismiss valid questions. At the same time, it was fantastic to see a young, smart, retail investor (Gali from Hyperchange) get to ask so many questions directly to the leadership team. I thought before the call that Gali would get to ask only one question, like the other analysts. He was able to ask almost 10! It was surreal. I was left feeling th…

A little more context from the WSJ article (https://www.wsj.com/articles/teslas-elon-musk-turns-conferen...)

>“We’re going to go to YouTube, sorry. These questions are so dry. They’re killing me.” He directed the operator to take questions from Tesla investor Galileo Russell, whose HyperChange TV YouTube channel features a video titled, “Why I Bought Tesla Today at $255/Share.”

>Mr. Russell, who had campaigned to get on the call usually reserved for analysts, got more than 20 minutes from Mr. Musk. The first of his dozen or so questions: When will Tesla launch its own network of driverless cars?

>“Thank you for an interesting question,” Mr. Musk replied.

It's especially cringey because if Musk was honest about that interesting question he would say he has no idea and should really be focusing on ramping up production. Instead it's a softball question that lets Musk proselytize on the radical world changing work that Tesla is doing...

Re: Tesla Plunges After a Conference Call

#39

Post by jacquesm » Thu, May 03, 2018, 5:50 PM UTC

imdsm wrote: post #21

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Sacconaghi pressed ahead with another query about Tesla lowering its 2018 capital expenditure projection to $3 billion, from $3.4 billion. Ahuja said the carmaker would spend less by simplifying its approach to automation and curtailing infrastructure outlays. 'And so where specifically will you be in terms of capital requirements?' Sacconaghi said. 'Excuse me. Next. Next,' Musk said to the call operator. 'Boring, b…

To be fair, he's not entirely wrong. I guess people just don't expect this type of response. But then, acting within the confines of normality isn't really the trait that may bring the dawn of a new era of humanity. Interestingly though, markets are reaction to this response emotionally.

The emotion seems to have been mostly on Musk's end of the line.

> But then, acting within the confines of normality isn't really the trait that may bring the dawn of a new era of humanity.

Tesla is not bringing 'the dawn of a new era of humanity', it's an electric car manufacturer. They came and went and now they're back.

Re: Tesla Plunges After a Conference Call

#40

Post by mmsimanga » Thu, May 03, 2018, 5:51 PM UTC

Having watched clip in the article and given I don't have any Tesla stock. Additionally having been an operations manager I have some sympathy for Musk. Every Tom, Dick, and Sally has an opinion but very few have the know-how to help. But in today's world who needs to be an expert to comment or pass judgment. On the one hand we have CEOs who chase the quarterly earnings at the cost of long-term sustainability. Musk says he isn't interested in short-term (in not so many words). Either way, you going to piss someone off. Like I said I don't have stock in the game.