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You have options – Why we left the U.S. and moved back to Europe

sam-the-man.com

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Re: You have options – Why we left the U.S. and moved back to Europe

#31

Post by jacquesm »

nostrademons wrote: post #25
jacquesm wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you explain the healthcare differences? From what I know it is pretty bad all over the USA compared to say France or Germany.

Healthcare is one of those areas where your experience varies dramatically based on how rich you (or your employer) are. I had nothing but good experiences when I was on Google's health plan - basically walk in to any of a number of top-notch, very wealthy clinics, don't pay a cent, get great care. Ditto when I was on my mom's government-employee plan. I was hospitalized with an acute kidney infection when I was 15,…

Ok, but the number of people employed by companies such as Google is very low compared to the total number of Americans.

So statistically speaking chances are that you'll find yourself on that 'other end of the spectrum'.

Re: You have options – Why we left the U.S. and moved back to Europe

#32

Post by innocentoldguy »

SirLJ wrote: post #15

The only problem with the US is that you have to report to IRS even if you live and work in some other place...

I'm currently in the process of moving out of the U.S. to Japan. I'm considering ditching my U.S. citizenship for this reason.

Re: You have options – Why we left the U.S. and moved back to Europe

#33

Post by nostrademons »

jacquesm wrote: post #31
nostrademons wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Healthcare is one of those areas where your experience varies dramatically based on how rich you (or your employer) are. I had nothing but good experiences when I was on Google's health plan - basically walk in to any of a number of top-notch, very wealthy clinics, don't pay a cent, get great care. Ditto when I was on my mom's government-employee plan. I was hospitalized with an acute kidney infection when I was 15,…

Ok, but the number of people employed by companies such as Google is very low compared to the total number of Americans. So statistically speaking chances are that you'll find yourself on that 'other end of the spectrum'.

Statistically speaking yes, health care in the U.S. sucks more than in countries with socialized medicine.

You are not a statistic. Evaluate your expected experience accordingly.

Re: You have options – Why we left the U.S. and moved back to Europe

#34

Post by samjc »

avenoir wrote: post #23

With all of the options he had he decided to move to ex-soviet republic... Let's see how long you'll manage to stay there before ludicrous levels of corruption at all levels of society start making expensive healthcare in the US seem insignificant in comparison. I say this as Ukrainian/Armenian who was born and lived in the USSR and seen my father, who's a brilliant engineer, stagnate in the professional culture that…

Estonia has quickly grown to be a very technological advanced country. I had several interviews within a week when I started applying, and I don't regret my decision. Who knows, it may change in a few years, but even if it does, I can always get up and move again.

Re: You have options – Why we left the U.S. and moved back to Europe

#35

Post by abqwe »

dazc wrote: post #26
holydude wrote: post #16

The grass is always greener on the other side. Being born in Europe and living here is suffocating me.

Europe is a big place and covers at least 6 different kinds of lifestyle and 3 kinds of weather. That's a few shades of grass to try before you give up entirely?

+1. And do not need a visa if you are European.

Re: You have options – Why we left the U.S. and moved back to Europe

#36

Post by dakrootie »

DanielDent wrote: post #8
ukulele wrote: post #5

It's funny that Florida has such a pristine reputation internationally. I'm from the Southern US, and my view of Florida is that it's where 80% of the crazies in the US live. Anytime I see a batsh*t crazy headline? Florida. Check the articles you see from now on and you'll notice a pattern. So to all the internationals: if you like the US but not its extremes, definitely don't move to Florida.

Florida has embraced open records laws, while other US jurisdictions have not - certainly not to the same extent. A significant portion of your observation can likely be attributed to reporting bias: it's easy/cheap for a journalist to browse the website of their local Florida police department. In another jurisdiction, that same story might involve: hiring an investigative journalist, spending 3 months, and fighting…

Thank you. I was waiting for someone to bring this up. Native Floridian, born and raised. My whole life I’ve lovingly referred to our mad little peninsula as “The Freakshow State” (from personal observation growing up in Miami-Dade). This area most certainly deserves the title, but there’s a whole lotta state left. Boring orange groves, swamp, and simple folk. If you stay away from a few metropolitan areas you’ll be good. Some areas are indeed crazy, but the public transparency laws paint the whole state as a festering cesspool.

Re: You have options – Why we left the U.S. and moved back to Europe

#37

Post by jacquesm »

nostrademons wrote: post #29
theyinwhy wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The quality of health care is so high in Europe that I really cannot imagine any European going to the US for treatment apart from perhaps very few experimental treatments that are not permitted in Europe.

Unsure what it's like in Europe, but when my Canadian cousin had a brain tumor, he went to the U.S. for treatment. Canada's health care system is on average better than the U.S, but when you have a brain tumor, you don't want an average doctor, you want the best. And by and large, these are still in the U.S. because they can make an order of magnitude more money than they could in a country with socialized medicine.

The US has a much larger number of inhabitants than Canada does, so a much larger number of people that could be outliers in any one profession. On top of that the bigger pay draws the top players from Canada as well. So it is no surprise that that 'best' doctor is in the US, it would be far more surprising if they were in Canada (and stayed there).

Re: You have options – Why we left the U.S. and moved back to Europe

#38

Post by pmoriarty »

I love to travel, meet other people, experience different cultures, and widen my horizons. For those reasons alone, I'd definitely advocate at least doing a lot of traveling to lots of different countries, and (if possible) trying to live in those countries you like best.

That said, I've found that living in other countries does have its down sides. The one that's bothered me most is being treated like a second-class citizen. In the countries I've been to, I've often felt like an outsider, or a cash machine, or a target. If you don't speak the language, you're usually treated even worse.

Those experiences have really given me a much stronger sense of empathy for how immigrants and other foreigners are treated in my own country, but has also made living in my own country feel a lot safer and more desirable.

I haven't given up on travel, and still like to do so to expand my horizons and experience places that are really different, but I really think twice about just jumping up and permanently moving somewhere else. Most expats can't take it long-term, and wind up moving back after a while. It's a rare breed who can move to a radically different country and remain -- unless, of course, they feel they have no other choice.

Re: You have options – Why we left the U.S. and moved back to Europe

#39

Post by samjc »

amaccuish wrote: post #18

What's it like in Tallin? I'm thinking of going to study there after I'm finished with my first degree? I like what they're doing to encourage startups etc. Can you speak Estonian?

The weather is vastly different and very cold, but I enjoy and missed the winter, and spring is almost here as well. The people are not as open to talk to strangers, but I've noticed that once they do open up, they are fun, honest people. I believe education is free over here, I haven't looked into it from an immigrant's perspective. I don't speak Estonian, as I currently don't need to... There are a bunch of tech companies who's primary language is English, so the incentive is still low, but if we do decide to stay long-term, I plan on learning it.

Re: You have options – Why we left the U.S. and moved back to Europe

#40

Post by throwaway84742 »

People tend to be irrational about things and this is a good illustration. As broken and expensive as US healthcare is, you’re making 3x the money here, and out of pocket maximums do kick in eventually. And the US is not the top country by far, even among developed ones, in number of mass murder victims per 100000 population. You’re vastly more likely to drown in your backyard pool than be a victim of a mass shooting in the US. Majority of firearm deaths are suicides. Majority of homicides are concentrated in crime / gang activity hubs like Detroit, Chicago, and a few others. Firearm homicide has been trending downward for decades, even if you take the crime hubs into account. IOW if you don’t live in one of the well known “bad” places, your chance of dying from a firearm wound is very low indeed.
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