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Nicotinamide riboside effects on aging similar to caloric restriction

colorado.edu

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Re: Nicotinamide riboside effects on aging similar to caloric restriction

#31

Post by Confusion »

blunte wrote: post #16
jimrandomh wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> consume 50%+ more than their healthier eastern counterparts That's not true. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_food_ener...

I'm sorry, 50% is higher than actual. But still, is 3750 for US vs 2550 for Indonesia (about the same population), or 2800 for Japan, or 2990 for China any indication of a significant caloric intake difference? Further, the type and quality of the food is likely much lower for the US group consider just the relative carbonated, sugared beverage.

These numbers include losses and waste. In the most extreme case the US could be wasting a third of their food, while achieving the same intake. So these numbers imply very little about actual calorie intake.

Re: Nicotinamide riboside effects on aging similar to caloric restriction

#32

Post by wpietri »

dang wrote: post #10
isoprophlex wrote: post #3

There is a very annoying, pervasive typo in the article and in the title on hn. It's 'nicotinamide'. In chemistry, an omide isn't really a thing. Edit: and I'll add another sour note... I noticed this now, but how often did i read a piece of journalism outside my area of expertise with equally lazy mistakes, without noticing them?

Thanks! we now have the right vowel above.

As long as you're adjusting the title, I'll point out that the study does not actually demonstrate that the effects on aging are similar. Just that taking the pill creates a metabolite that might possibly have an effect on aging.

Re: Nicotinamide riboside effects on aging similar to caloric restriction

#33

Post by p0wn »

Maybestring wrote: post #26
allthenews wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How much of that relates to the average body size? I imagine smaller people eat less.

I hypothesise a feedback loop by which people that eat more grow in size. I have conducted some experiments on myself which are consistent with this theory.

Average male height is 5'2" in Indonesia. The US is 5'9". How has your feedback loop of eating more helped grow and shrink your vertical height?

Re: Nicotinamide riboside effects on aging similar to caloric restriction

#34

Post by riku_iki »

Maybestring wrote: post #26
allthenews wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How much of that relates to the average body size? I imagine smaller people eat less.

I hypothesise a feedback loop by which people that eat more grow in size. I have conducted some experiments on myself which are consistent with this theory.

Did you test any genetics self-adjustments?

Re: Nicotinamide riboside effects on aging similar to caloric restriction

#35

Post by e9 »

deegles wrote: post #20

Does anyone know where to get it in bulk form? The commercial stuff I've seen seems way overpriced. Also, I'm happy for the disclosure but be wary of potential bias... > The study was partially funded by grants from the National Institutes of Health and the American Federation for Aging Research. ChromaDex, the maker of NIAGEN provided supplements and some financial support.

Just use high quality niacin/nicotinic acid/vitamin-b3. "niacin supplementation increases cellular nicotinamide adenine dinucleotide (NAD+) levels"

reference: https://examine.com/supplements/vitamin-b3/

Re: Nicotinamide riboside effects on aging similar to caloric restriction

#36

Post by reasonattlm »

deegles wrote: post #20

Does anyone know where to get it in bulk form? The commercial stuff I've seen seems way overpriced. Also, I'm happy for the disclosure but be wary of potential bias... > The study was partially funded by grants from the National Institutes of Health and the American Federation for Aging Research. ChromaDex, the maker of NIAGEN provided supplements and some financial support.

There are any number of suppliers other than the sole sanctioned one. Search Alibaba. Assume you will pay a fraction of what you'd pay the sanctioned suppliers, but you will also have to run a sample via a LC-MS analysis to see that you are in fact getting what you think you are getting. This is all pretty easy to arrange, and works for just about any well known compound, peptide, etc.

If you are willing to do that, one would hope that you are also willing to (a) actually assess the results with the more robust quantified self metrics, rather than just hoping and feeling, as so many people do, and (b) take full responsibility for any harms or legal issues you cause yourself in the course of experimenting, as so few people do.

The detailed guides section here contains a couple of posts that walk through this process for a couple of other items, but the same general outline applies in exactly the same way:

https://www.fightaging.org/self-experimentation/

Re: Nicotinamide riboside effects on aging similar to caloric restriction

#37

Post by Confusion »

oakwhiz wrote: post #5
isoprophlex wrote: post #3

There is a very annoying, pervasive typo in the article and in the title on hn. It's 'nicotinamide'. In chemistry, an omide isn't really a thing. Edit: and I'll add another sour note... I noticed this now, but how often did i read a piece of journalism outside my area of expertise with equally lazy mistakes, without noticing them?

>how often did i read a piece of journalism outside my area of expertise with equally lazy mistakes, without noticing them? This is often referred to as the "Gell-Mann Amnesia Effect": "Briefly stated, the Gell-Mann Amnesia effect works as follows. You open the newspaper to an article on some subject you know well. In Murray’s case, physics. In mine, show business. You read the article and see the journalist has abso…

Which should of course not be exaggerated and fully blamed on the reporter.

A reporter not understanding what a physicist explained does not mean they lack the ability to understand what a policeman or politician told them.

A reporter not being able to explain a theory does not mean they cannot correctly report on the plain facts of a murder or a policy proposal.

In such cases the risks are inferences drawn from the (lack of) facts, the reliability of the source (material), etc. Every kind of article requires scepticism of different aspects. Just ensuring you don't suffer from Gell-Mann Amnesia is woefully insufficient.

Re: Nicotinamide riboside effects on aging similar to caloric restriction

#38

Post by JoshMnem »

I think calorie restriction is a more interesting idea, because it forces you to think about eating high-nutrient foods. The first things I did were to eliminate sugars and other processed ingredients, including all flours.

Continuing to eat junk and assuming that pills and supplements will compensate for that is probably not a good idea.

Re: Nicotinamide riboside effects on aging similar to caloric restriction

#39

Post by ccho »

p0wn wrote: post #33
Maybestring wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I hypothesise a feedback loop by which people that eat more grow in size. I have conducted some experiments on myself which are consistent with this theory.

Average male height is 5'2" in Indonesia. The US is 5'9". How has your feedback loop of eating more helped grow and shrink your vertical height?

I assumed radial growth

Re: Nicotinamide riboside effects on aging similar to caloric restriction

#40

Post by johnchristopher »

I like that comment from a few days ago https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16675412

> Go look at the studies showing resistance training to be pretty effective in seniors before getting excited about NAD+ boosters. The resistance training is probably cheaper and better. One still has studies such as the one showing that dietary nicotinamide doesn't do a great deal in mice [3] - like sirtuin manipulations, it helps fat mice a little, but is distinctly unimpressive otherwise.

> Remember that calorie restriction extends life by 40% in mice, but probably five years or less in humans - the effects of all these stress response related mechanisms of metabolic manipulation work through a few overlapping core processes, and scale down with species longevity. That's why I see them as a dead end in comparison to other strategies.

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