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UberCab to disrupt the Taxi/Limo business

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Re: UberCab to disrupt the Taxi/Limo business

#31

Post by bravura »

jtbigwoo wrote: post #24

Driving a gypsy cab (which is what ubercab is) is a dangerous business. In the 90's, New York averaged something like 2 murdered cabbies a month. And those drivers were only being robbed for a small amount of cash. This application could be very attractive for car jackers. A bad guy could simply place and order for an out-of-the-way alley or warehouse and know that the cabbie they hail is going to be driving a really…

Your comment is specious.

In the 90's, New York averaged something like 2 murdered cabbies a month.

Uh... NYC was a dangerous place in the mid 90's. Do you have evidence that the gypsy cabs were targets more than yellow cabs?

It's not the gypsy cabs that were the problem, it was the customers.

A would-be car jacker would need to use a stolen iPhone and credit card in order to keep from getting caught right away, but that's hardly an insurmountable barrier.

In that case, UberCab would need a stronger way to identify users. For example, you enter the cab, and the cabbie takes a photo of you with his iPhone UberCab app and uploads first thing.

Re: UberCab to disrupt the Taxi/Limo business

#33

Post by tlrobinson »

sprout wrote: post #28
yummyfajitas wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Certainly the fact that the driver is completely traceable (more so than a yellow cab driver) would dissuade most criminally inclined cabbies.

I don't think you're at all correct that they are less traceable than yellow cab drivers. The government bureaucracy makes it much more difficult to fake credentials and make yourself untraceable. With UberCab, it looks like anyone could steal an iPhone/credit card, download the app, and sign up as a driver all in the space of an hour.

Well, with ubercab you have a record of who the driver and passenger are before you even step into a cab. I can't tell you the last time I bothered to look at a cab number or license.

Re: UberCab to disrupt the Taxi/Limo business

#34

Post by yummyfajitas »

sprout wrote: post #28
yummyfajitas wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Certainly the fact that the driver is completely traceable (more so than a yellow cab driver) would dissuade most criminally inclined cabbies.

I don't think you're at all correct that they are less traceable than yellow cab drivers. The government bureaucracy makes it much more difficult to fake credentials and make yourself untraceable. With UberCab, it looks like anyone could steal an iPhone/credit card, download the app, and sign up as a driver all in the space of an hour.

I think you wrote "less" when you mean "more". Assuming that's what you meant, I disagree. From their website, it looks as if UberCab requires drivers to be a livery company, so gov credentials are required either way.

The only way I can see the stolen iphone game working is if you steal the iphone from an UberCab driver, or convince UberCab that you are an independent livery and then rape someone before the stolen iphone gets cut off.

In contrast, a legitimate yellow cabbie just needs to put his coat on top of the taxi license and make sure the victim doesn't see his license plate # as he drives away. That same game won't work with a legitimate UberCabbie, since there is an electronic record that driver X picked up passenger Y.

Re: UberCab to disrupt the Taxi/Limo business

#35

Post by jtbigwoo »

bravura wrote: post #31
jtbigwoo wrote: post #24

Driving a gypsy cab (which is what ubercab is) is a dangerous business. In the 90's, New York averaged something like 2 murdered cabbies a month. And those drivers were only being robbed for a small amount of cash. This application could be very attractive for car jackers. A bad guy could simply place and order for an out-of-the-way alley or warehouse and know that the cabbie they hail is going to be driving a really…

Your comment is specious. In the 90's, New York averaged something like 2 murdered cabbies a month. Uh... NYC was a dangerous place in the mid 90's. Do you have evidence that the gypsy cabs were targets more than yellow cabs? It's not the gypsy cabs that were the problem, it was the customers. A would-be car jacker would need to use a stolen iPhone and credit card in order to keep from getting caught right away, but…

Uh... NYC was a dangerous place in the mid 90's. Do you have evidence that the gypsy cabs were targets more than yellow cabs?

Yep. http://www.taxi-library.org/marosi.htm

"Out of the 85 total cab drivers killed in 1992 and 1993, for instance, only 12 drove yellow cabs."

The difference here is that gypsy cab drivers work in more dangerous neighborhoods that are underserved by big taxi companies. I suppose ubercab drivers could just avoid those same neighborhoods...

Re: UberCab to disrupt the Taxi/Limo business

#36

Post by tptacek »

ced wrote: post #25
tptacek wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Disagree. The policies behind medallions may be stupid and unfair, but their existence provides a mechanism of accountability (you can lose them, and they're hellaciously expensive) that doesn't exist with iPhone dispatch. It doesn't surprise you that cab drivers in Chicago basically never drive you to random destinations, or change fares midway through the ride? The goodness of cab driver hearts isn't what's prevent…

What prevents you from walking away without paying? (that's a genuine question, not a flippant remark)

Physical intimidation.

Re: UberCab to disrupt the Taxi/Limo business

#37

Post by tptacek »

cabalamat wrote: post #29
tptacek wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Disagree. The policies behind medallions may be stupid and unfair, but their existence provides a mechanism of accountability (you can lose them, and they're hellaciously expensive) that doesn't exist with iPhone dispatch. It doesn't surprise you that cab drivers in Chicago basically never drive you to random destinations, or change fares midway through the ride? The goodness of cab driver hearts isn't what's prevent…

> It doesn't surprise you that cab drivers in Chicago basically never drive you to random destinations, or change fares midway through the ride? The goodness of cab driver hearts isn't what's preventing it. A voluntary medallion scheme would prevent that; the city government could issue medallions to those who fitted whatever standards it chose to lay down. And customers would be free to choose to use a medallioned o…

Don't get me wrong; the city medallion systems are evil. I'm just saying they're a necessary evil. If we could replace them with something sane, I'm onboard!

Re: UberCab to disrupt the Taxi/Limo business

#38

Post by tptacek »

patio11 wrote: post #26
tptacek wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Disagree. The policies behind medallions may be stupid and unfair, but their existence provides a mechanism of accountability (you can lose them, and they're hellaciously expensive) that doesn't exist with iPhone dispatch. It doesn't surprise you that cab drivers in Chicago basically never drive you to random destinations, or change fares midway through the ride? The goodness of cab driver hearts isn't what's prevent…

I do more of my traveling from airport to suburbs than inside the city, so I get to use a car service. It is pretty simple: I call American Taxi (by way of Bangalore), they send me an Eastern European immigrant with a car, and he whisks me home for the published flat fee. Their incentive to not screw me is that they value my continued custom (and chargebacks are a beast). His incentive to not screw me is that he valu…

Putting it on the iPhone scales the process up. Some things work fine at Patrick McKenzie scales, but not so fine at 40 fares per day per cab. There is immense competition for airport fares (it's one of the big problems with cab service in SF) and more incentive not to play games. The same can't be said of random fares on city streets.

The only time I've ever been screwed with by a cab driver was with an unlicensed car service.

Re: UberCab to disrupt the Taxi/Limo business

#39

Post by [deleted] »

smoody wrote: post #6

a friend of a good friend of mine was brutally raped by an independent Lincoln Town Car licensed driver (in NYC). I would advise (my personal opinion) women to avoid such services and deal with the hassle of getting a cab. Getting into a stranger's car and closing the door behind you is an action that should not be taken lightly. That is why I always take a taxi or use a well-established car service (as in substantia…

[deleted]

Re: UberCab to disrupt the Taxi/Limo business

#40

Post by joshwa »

Here's a great article on the biggest car service in Brooklyn-- Arecibo (their base station is around the corner from where I live). Many interesting details about the economics, technology, and politics of the livery business in NYC:

http://nymag.com/print/?/news/features/54678/

From a safety perspective, in NYC it's illegal (and not a good idea) to hail a non-yellow-medallioned taxi on the street. They likely don't have a TLC license, and may or may not be affiliated with a larger fleet.

Call the service's base station--they might not perform background checks on the drivers, but they'll be licensed and insured. The services have an incentive to weed out the bad drivers-- if they get a reputation for spotty service or creepy guys, then customers will switch to the car service down the block (there is healthy competition in this market-- they are constantly splitting off and trying to poach each others' drivers).

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