HP EliteBook: A friend to the User • Hacker News Board

Re: HP EliteBook: A friend to the User

#31

Post by Xylakant » Thu, Feb 08, 2018, 10:21 AM UTC

grumpyprole wrote: post #25

Another counterexample to the "Apple make the best hardware" meme that is so often repeated. I find the whole concept of a disposable 1000+ dollar machine with a glued-in battery rather abhorrent.

The glued-in battery makes fixing it at home harder, but comes with significant weight and space savings. It’s a trade off, like so many things and many people (including me) are willing to accept it. Apple is not the only manufacturer to do this, my Thinkpad has a non-user-serviceable battery as well. It’s not like the battery cannot be replaced, and I’m willing to have my machine serviced at an authorized repair shop when the battery needs changing. In exchange I get a lighter and slimmer laptop that I lug around every day. The cost for a battery change on a MacBook is just slightly higher than the battery for the older models.

This may not be a trade off you’re willing to make, but it does not make the machine disposable.

Re: HP EliteBook: A friend to the User

#32

Post by dahauns » Thu, Feb 08, 2018, 10:21 AM UTC

Two models I'd like to add to this as examples that this is actually possible with all form factors:

First the The HP Elite X2, a Surface Pro-class tablet. Quite analogous to the EliteBook - sadly the RAM is soldered (IIRC one of their first actually still had a SODIMM slot):

https://ifixit.org/blog/8135/hats-off-to-hps-repairable-tabl...

https://ifixit.org/blog/9309/hp-elite-x2-1012-g2/

And second, the Fujitsu Lifebook U93x. smaller and lighter than most Business-Ultrabooks - almost MacBook 12 size/weight, but still KabyLake U, >10h battery and everything socketed+lots of ports (including USB-A, HDMI, even full size Ethernet!):

https://www.notebookcheck.net/Fujitsu-LifeBook-U937-Core-i5-...

Re: HP EliteBook: A friend to the User

#33

Post by willtim » Thu, Feb 08, 2018, 10:23 AM UTC

mrtksn wrote: post #15

koyote wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But it's not just repairing, it's being able to upgrade. I have a 6 year-old Lenovo and it's still performing amazingly. Since buying it I have upgraded the HDD twice (to an SSD and then to a slightly larger and faster SSD), upgraded the RAM once and even upgraded the screen (to a higher resolution IPS display that was backwards compatible). If I had bought an un-upgradable laptop I'd probably already have had to buy…

Upgradeability, in most cases, is just a cost-saving feature. In some industrial settings, upgradability can be crucial indeed. For example, where cutting-edge performance is needed you might want to be able to upgrade the CPU of your workstation when a new version is released but this is hardly the case for Laptops except for some extreme cases like laptops used at the ISS.

Upgrading isn't just about saving money. It's also a more environmentally responsible thing to do. People are "upgrading" to new iPhones just because their glued-in battery is end-of-life.

Re: HP EliteBook: A friend to the User

#34

Post by dagw » Thu, Feb 08, 2018, 10:24 AM UTC

Nullabillity wrote: post #20

koyote wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But it's not just repairing, it's being able to upgrade. I have a 6 year-old Lenovo and it's still performing amazingly. Since buying it I have upgraded the HDD twice (to an SSD and then to a slightly larger and faster SSD), upgraded the RAM once and even upgraded the screen (to a higher resolution IPS display that was backwards compatible). If I had bought an un-upgradable laptop I'd probably already have had to buy…

Yup. It's also surprisingly hard to find a decent new laptop these days. About a week ago I started at a new company, and was asked to find a laptop that I wanted. The cheapest one with a 1TB SSD was ~$2000, and the cheapest one that would be decent out of the box was a $1300 Dell. Instead I ended up getting a $600 gaming laptoo with a decent CPU, and installed the RAM and SSD myself for $450, ending up with a far be…

I can certainly see doing that if it's your own money. But if I start a new job and the first thing they do is make me cobble together a laptop of spare parts so that they can save a few hundred bucks, then I'm sending out my resume later that afternoon.

Re: HP EliteBook: A friend to the User

#35

Post by Xylakant » Thu, Feb 08, 2018, 10:25 AM UTC

aidos wrote: post #29

Does anyone know what the story is for running Linux on EliteBooks? For context, I'm in the market for a slightly older laptop for my daughter. Something that I could maybe pick up on ebay (in the UK) and upgrade some components would be ideal. Would prefer one I can put Linux on. The Chromebook route turned into a pain when I tried it so I'd like a machine I have some control over.

Thinkpads might be a good option. Linux support is fairly good, especially the older models and the T-Series does have some models with upgradable RAM and battery. (Not the slim T4x0s)

Re: HP EliteBook: A friend to the User

#36

Post by lolc » Thu, Feb 08, 2018, 10:26 AM UTC

mrtksn wrote: post #15

koyote wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But it's not just repairing, it's being able to upgrade. I have a 6 year-old Lenovo and it's still performing amazingly. Since buying it I have upgraded the HDD twice (to an SSD and then to a slightly larger and faster SSD), upgraded the RAM once and even upgraded the screen (to a higher resolution IPS display that was backwards compatible). If I had bought an un-upgradable laptop I'd probably already have had to buy…

Upgradeability, in most cases, is just a cost-saving feature. In some industrial settings, upgradability can be crucial indeed. For example, where cutting-edge performance is needed you might want to be able to upgrade the CPU of your workstation when a new version is released but this is hardly the case for Laptops except for some extreme cases like laptops used at the ISS.

Upgrading and repairing is cost-saving in absolute terms by using less resources.

Re: HP EliteBook: A friend to the User

#37

Post by chopin » Thu, Feb 08, 2018, 10:28 AM UTC

Double_a_92 wrote: post #24

prima-facie wrote: post #7

I'm glad companies are finally coming back to this. Looks very similar to my Inspiron I bought a few years ago. Once you open up the back plate everything is laid nicely in front of you ready to service. I changed my RAM/HDD/Wifi NIC in a matter of minutes. In case you're wondering the model is Dell Inspiron 15-7537 from 2013.

I had a 2010 Inspiron, it was much worse back then. I remember that it overheated and I wanted to open it to remove dust and apply fresh thermal paste... I literally had to remove every single piece of it, they were all spread all over my room :D

That's strange, I have 2009 Inspiron (1545 iirc), where this is easy. There's a bunch of Youtube videos for that.

Re: HP EliteBook: A friend to the User

#38

Post by jotm » Thu, Feb 08, 2018, 10:29 AM UTC

aidos wrote: post #29

Does anyone know what the story is for running Linux on EliteBooks? For context, I'm in the market for a slightly older laptop for my daughter. Something that I could maybe pick up on ebay (in the UK) and upgrade some components would be ideal. Would prefer one I can put Linux on. The Chromebook route turned into a pain when I tried it so I'd like a machine I have some control over.

Which model? In my experience with the Elitebook/Zbook workstations Linux runs fine, but always with minor problems (top panel buttons not working, issues with shutdown [does not actually shutdown, have to press power button], TurboBoost being disabled until reboot, varies by distro)... HP really don't seem to care about Linux, either.

Re: HP EliteBook: A friend to the User

#39

Post by SmellyGeekBoy » Thu, Feb 08, 2018, 10:29 AM UTC

I don't see the Dell XPS 15 9560 on their site but I was pleasantly surprised when I dismantled mine the other day (to re-do the thermal compound, which I can highly recommend btw).

It looks very similar to the HP inside and everything seems to be upgradeable / swappable - M2 SSD, MiniPCIE wifi / bluetooth module, proper socketed RAM, battery, fans etc. etc.

I was genuinely surprised considering it's a fairly sleek and compact machine for the spec.

That said, I didn't take apart the screen so I can't speak for the webcam or LCD panel.

Re: HP EliteBook: A friend to the User

#40

Post by pcr0 » Thu, Feb 08, 2018, 10:29 AM UTC

On the flip side, the % of space taken up by the battery is tiny compared to macbooks.

One could argue that of all the components in a laptop, the battery wearing down is what most people will face, so having custom components + a larger battery might be better than having modular components.