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Literary fiction in crisis as sales drop dramatically

theguardian.com

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Re: Literary fiction in crisis as sales drop dramatically

#31

Post by scandox »

The negativity here about Literary fiction is interesting. A lot of people implying that readers don't enjoy it or that it's elitist or a status symbol etc...

I think it's important to accept that there is a group of people - perhaps small - that love reading literary fiction. It's not reasonable to assume bad faith, just because you can't see the merit in something. There maybe people that use it as a means of identifying with a group and not out of genuine passion or interest - but that is true of every group. You always have people who attach themselves in this way: programming and tech world are a classic case.

Anyway just because something seems esoteric does not mean the person iis not enjoying it. We all have radically different needs, experiences and interests. And it's OK. Anyone who thinks that because they read literary fiction they are superior in some way is foolish certainly. On the other hand they may quite reasonably say that they consider one form of fiction to be aesthetically superior: that is the nature of aesthetics - we all get our say.

Re: Literary fiction in crisis as sales drop dramatically

#32

Post by watwut »

Arnt wrote: post #6
mirimir wrote: post #3

I don't know what "literary fiction" is, exactly. I suspect that, for the most part, it's been a status symbol. Back in the day, one needed copies of the latest stuff on tables and shelves. But on Facebook, one can fake it, based on Goodreads etc. No dead trees needed.

Around one in five, one in four books were bought with no intention of reading. On one hand that's a lot of faking, on on other, the other three fourths is much more and not fake. (Source: Editors I knew, over alcoholic beverages.) EDIT: "Were", not "are", because I've lost touch in the past years and don't know how it is nowadays. Sales have dropped, the audience may have too. (Still see gorgeous women in the booksh…

If I buy it for someone else or out of loyalty to author, is it counted as no intention to read? If I buy it and then somehow am not in mood to read it or dislike it after few pages, how does it count?

Also, majority of games bought at steam is never played. People buy it because they are discounted and there never go around playing. It is not for show, cause nobody see that. Large portion of those 1 in four gonna be like that too.

Re: Literary fiction in crisis as sales drop dramatically

#33

Post by YouAreGreat »

scandox wrote: post #31

The negativity here about Literary fiction is interesting. A lot of people implying that readers don't enjoy it or that it's elitist or a status symbol etc... I think it's important to accept that there is a group of people - perhaps small - that love reading literary fiction. It's not reasonable to assume bad faith, just because you can't see the merit in something. There maybe people that use it as a means of ident…

> there is a group of people - perhaps small

Right, but this post is not about the vanishing of Literary fiction from the face of the earth.

A merely shrinking market is obviously consistent with the idea that some (or much) of it formerly sold to people who weren't really enjoying spending hours with a genre almost defined by not having much in the way of story or ideas, which in turn is consistent with the hypothesis that part of the market was sustained by status signaling.

Re: Literary fiction in crisis as sales drop dramatically

#34

Post by mark_l_watson »

My wife enjoys literary fiction and I enjoy reading scifi (most recently Chinese scifi). We spend quite a bit of money on new eBooks, books, and audible books.

Everyone gets to decide what they enjoy and how they spend their time. I generally enjoy good writing and good movies over spending time with miscellaneous web browsing and network TV. I have friends and family who love watching TV or hanging out on Facebook and that is fine because everyone gets to decide how they spend their time.

It is important to me that producers of great content get paid so even though I enjoy spending time in my local library, I prefer to purchase entertainment material.

Re: Literary fiction in crisis as sales drop dramatically

#35

Post by scandox »

YouAreGreat wrote: post #33
scandox wrote: post #31

The negativity here about Literary fiction is interesting. A lot of people implying that readers don't enjoy it or that it's elitist or a status symbol etc... I think it's important to accept that there is a group of people - perhaps small - that love reading literary fiction. It's not reasonable to assume bad faith, just because you can't see the merit in something. There maybe people that use it as a means of ident…

> there is a group of people - perhaps small Right, but this post is not about the vanishing of Literary fiction from the face of the earth. A merely shrinking market is obviously consistent with the idea that some (or much) of it formerly sold to people who weren't really enjoying spending hours with a genre almost defined by not having much in the way of story or ideas, which in turn is consistent with the hypothes…

I think again to say "defined by not having much in the way of stories or ideas" is a level of dismissal that suggests something stronger than mere indifference. A lot of people have bad early experiences with literary fiction and I'd agree that when it's bad, it's the worst. But when it's good it can be exceptional. It also does not preclude strong stories, or idea driven stories. Of course a great deal of it is about capturing subjective human experience in a way that - when it fails for a reader - leaves them with nothing. But when it works it can be incredible.

Generally what I find is that once peoplelike a work of literary fiction they no longer think of it as "literary" - they sort see it in a category of its own.

Re: Literary fiction in crisis as sales drop dramatically

#36

Post by SyneRyder »

jamesrcole wrote: post #28
matt4077 wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Surveys? Or, possibly, the book:ebook sales ratios?

Unless a survey asks specially about whether a person bought a book with no intention of ever reading it AND people actually provide an honest answer to that question, then I can't see how a survey could provide the answers. How do you think sales ratios could provide the figures about people's purchase intentions?

There do exist services for buying books purely for aesthetic reasons, like Books By The Foot. They've got a special now for "Holly & Ivy", for $49 per foot you can buy books with green or red colored spines to give your house a Christmas ambience:

https://www.booksbythefoot.com/shop/pc/Holly-Ivy-3p232.htm

I assume sales to those services are nowhere near as high as 20%, but counting sales to similar services (and Hollywood set designers, bulk orders to interior decorators, etc) could go some way towards calculating a percentage.

Re: Literary fiction in crisis as sales drop dramatically

#37

Post by nabla9 »

scandox wrote: post #31

The negativity here about Literary fiction is interesting. A lot of people implying that readers don't enjoy it or that it's elitist or a status symbol etc... I think it's important to accept that there is a group of people - perhaps small - that love reading literary fiction. It's not reasonable to assume bad faith, just because you can't see the merit in something. There maybe people that use it as a means of ident…

"A classic is something that everybody wants to have read and nobody wants to read." – Mark Twain

I have natural 'aversion' for literary fiction. It's hard for me to get started, so I very rarely read them. But when I finally stumble reading one, I'm usually happy that I did.

Example: I have only read one book from Dostoyevsky: 'Notes from Underground'. I chose it because it was short. But oh boy was it deep, heavy and mind bending. I still carry that book with me (figuratively).

I don't hesitate to admit that I'm dirty commoner when it comes to literary, but I'm honest enough to admit that there are things 'that would be good for me' and I would love to have read those books but I'm shutting myself out of them. I'm sure literary fiction is full of crap but the best of them are far ahead of commercial genre fiction (there is intersection of genre fiction and literary fiction of course).

Re: Literary fiction in crisis as sales drop dramatically

#38

Post by watwut »

scandox wrote: post #35
YouAreGreat wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> there is a group of people - perhaps small Right, but this post is not about the vanishing of Literary fiction from the face of the earth. A merely shrinking market is obviously consistent with the idea that some (or much) of it formerly sold to people who weren't really enjoying spending hours with a genre almost defined by not having much in the way of story or ideas, which in turn is consistent with the hypothes…

I think again to say "defined by not having much in the way of stories or ideas" is a level of dismissal that suggests something stronger than mere indifference. A lot of people have bad early experiences with literary fiction and I'd agree that when it's bad, it's the worst. But when it's good it can be exceptional. It also does not preclude strong stories, or idea driven stories. Of course a great deal of it is abo…

Most of people who dismiss that category of books this way do it out of prejudice and never read them. It is no different then rejecting SF as stupid without ever bothering to read much of it.

Re: Literary fiction in crisis as sales drop dramatically

#39

Post by jamesrcole »

SyneRyder wrote: post #36
jamesrcole wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unless a survey asks specially about whether a person bought a book with no intention of ever reading it AND people actually provide an honest answer to that question, then I can't see how a survey could provide the answers. How do you think sales ratios could provide the figures about people's purchase intentions?

There do exist services for buying books purely for aesthetic reasons, like Books By The Foot. They've got a special now for "Holly & Ivy", for $49 per foot you can buy books with green or red colored spines to give your house a Christmas ambience: https://www.booksbythefoot.com/shop/pc/Holly-Ivy-3p232.htm I assume sales to those services are nowhere near as high as 20%, but counting sales to similar services (and Ho…

Those figures would be interesting, but none of them are going to give accurate numbers for the numbers the original comment was talking about, because they tell you nothing of the number of people who buy the books (with no intention of reading them) by more conventional means. They don't provide any way to infer those numbers.

Re: Literary fiction in crisis as sales drop dramatically

#40

Post by ycombinete »

scandox wrote: post #35
YouAreGreat wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> there is a group of people - perhaps small Right, but this post is not about the vanishing of Literary fiction from the face of the earth. A merely shrinking market is obviously consistent with the idea that some (or much) of it formerly sold to people who weren't really enjoying spending hours with a genre almost defined by not having much in the way of story or ideas, which in turn is consistent with the hypothes…

I think again to say "defined by not having much in the way of stories or ideas" is a level of dismissal that suggests something stronger than mere indifference. A lot of people have bad early experiences with literary fiction and I'd agree that when it's bad, it's the worst. But when it's good it can be exceptional. It also does not preclude strong stories, or idea driven stories. Of course a great deal of it is abo…

Your original comment was great, and this exchange really just cements the point you made there.
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