Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Microsoft launches a PC vs Mac website

microsoft.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

31–40 of 41 posts

Re: Microsoft launches a PC vs Mac website

#31

Post by epochwolf »

sorbus wrote: post #30
epochwolf wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Another thing to think about: My mac is able to my TV without any bugs. (Major use case for my laptop) The screen just flashes and I'm ready to go. When I'm done I can be programming again just by unplugging the adapter. No more fixing my desktop icons. (Don't get me started on how windows handles multiple monitors!)

That's the exact same behavior my laptop, running windows 7, has when connected to an HDTV (multiple monitors work fine, and it's never messed up my desktop, as well). There's no adapter needed, either, which seems to be what that point was getting at - my highschool, which had standardized on mac laptops, was constantly plagued by difficulties finding adapters when using computers to run projectors. They were consta…

Nice.

As for adapters, I carry all my own adapters with me, when there is the slightest chance of needing them. (But I have a mac with a standard DVI port, makes things easier)

Re: Microsoft launches a PC vs Mac website

#32

Post by quesera »

elblanco wrote: post #19
j79 wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My guess: The brass at Microsoft was probably thrilled when Apple switched to Intel. To them, this meant easy virtualization/dual boot setups, so obviously, more licenses sold for Windows (because, c'mon, everyone needs Windows with that vast library of software that EVERYONE uses!) Then they realized people switching were happy with just OS X and the cross platform available titles....

Raise your hands if you own a Mac and don't have a virtualization/dual-boot setup. crickets

I think you're very wrong if you assume that most Mac users also run Windows.

Anecdotally, the only Mac users I know who run a VM at all do so for IE testing, or occasionally for some other UNIX variant. Then again, i don't know many people who are super hardcore gamers.

Re: Microsoft launches a PC vs Mac website

#33

Post by elblanco »

quesera wrote: post #32
elblanco wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Raise your hands if you own a Mac and don't have a virtualization/dual-boot setup. crickets

I think you're very wrong if you assume that most Mac users also run Windows. Anecdotally, the only Mac users I know who run a VM at all do so for IE testing, or occasionally for some other UNIX variant. Then again, i don't know many people who are super hardcore gamers.

I actually don't know a mac user that doesn't at least have boot camp installed.

Re: Microsoft launches a PC vs Mac website

#34

Post by j79 »

elblanco wrote: post #19
j79 wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My guess: The brass at Microsoft was probably thrilled when Apple switched to Intel. To them, this meant easy virtualization/dual boot setups, so obviously, more licenses sold for Windows (because, c'mon, everyone needs Windows with that vast library of software that EVERYONE uses!) Then they realized people switching were happy with just OS X and the cross platform available titles....

Raise your hands if you own a Mac and don't have a virtualization/dual-boot setup. crickets

I don't. Every Mac user I know doesn't. Maybe I'm a weird demographic (I switched back in 2000 - prior to that, I used Windows strictly - from DOS/3.1 up to 2000!)

I've found that any Windows software I need (i.e, some software to capture a stream or a uTorrent-equivalent client before uTorrent was available...), there's an equivalent version on the Mac.

I do still use a Windows machine (and have worked on a Windows machine from XP, Vista and currently Win 7 Enterprise) - but personally, I have no need for it. Although, honestly, I find Windows 7 quite nice.

Re: Microsoft launches a PC vs Mac website

#35

Post by teilo »

tptacek wrote: post #3

You know... all snark aside, a lot of these things are true: * Macs get a tiny fraction of the games available to Windows. * Macs really don't have Bluray support. * Macs really are different from Windows, although they are different in arguably a good way, and my mom had no trouble learning them. * Macs really do a crappy job with Word and Excel, and like it or not, and regardless of the degree to which this is MSFT…

You can entirely blame Microsoft for the crappy Office experience on the Mac. They had one of the earliest full-featured word processors on the Mac, which historically was way better than MacWrite, and arguably, Nissus. It's been down hill ever since.

Their claims regarding the Office suite are transparently stupid: "Apple's productivity suite file formats won't open in Microsoft Office on PCs. This can be a real hassle for Mac users sharing work documents with PC users." Excuse me, but you have to PAY for that Apple suite, just like you have to PAY for Microsoft Office on Mac. Does Microsoft mean to tell us that Office for Mac is a real hassle for Mac users to use in order to share documents with PC users? Well, now that you mention it, it is! They can't even keep their own office suites compatible, and I'm not talking OLE or VBA crap.

"If there's a Mac version of a program you need, you'll have to buy it again and relearn how to use it on a Mac." No kidding, and thank you very much, Microsoft, for making the Mac version of Office so slow, clunky, and stupid.

NeoOffice launches faster than Word or Excel. Want to edit a cell in Excel? Don't waste your time with F2, or many other shortcuts that are changed for no apparent reason. Oh, and every time you launch a new Excel document, change your view from page-break view (with gaps for the margins!!!) back to the normal spreadsheet view that almost every other spreadsheet in existence starts with by default. Add a font to the OS? "Optimizing font menu" and add 30 seconds to the startup of either program. This does not happen on any other Mac software I use, and I use three other word processors, and the Adobe suite.(And yes, I am on Office 2008).

I can run the Windows version of Office faster in Parallels, than I can run the native Mac version on a bloody Mac.

They just absolutely will not make actual Mac software. And you cannot convince me that this is anything but intentional. The Mac version of office is deliberately stunted to make Mac's look slow and clunky.

Re: Microsoft launches a PC vs Mac website

#36

Post by etherael »

teilo wrote: post #35
tptacek wrote: post #3

You know... all snark aside, a lot of these things are true: * Macs get a tiny fraction of the games available to Windows. * Macs really don't have Bluray support. * Macs really are different from Windows, although they are different in arguably a good way, and my mom had no trouble learning them. * Macs really do a crappy job with Word and Excel, and like it or not, and regardless of the degree to which this is MSFT…

You can entirely blame Microsoft for the crappy Office experience on the Mac. They had one of the earliest full-featured word processors on the Mac, which historically was way better than MacWrite, and arguably, Nissus. It's been down hill ever since. Their claims regarding the Office suite are transparently stupid: "Apple's productivity suite file formats won't open in Microsoft Office on PCs. This can be a real has…

Like Internet Explorer is deliberately stunted to make web applications look slow and clunky. But once a critical mass is reached and people see the alternatives outside the microsoft ecosystem (chrome in the browser, neooffice etc on mac) People end up realising that MS are just really bad in environments that they do not control, whether this is on purpose or not at that point really ceases to matter.

For the record, I think it's a bit of both, why invest in attaining mastery in products you directly compete with, it makes sense to half ass your effort to cast the platform in the most negative light possible.

And before apple zealots get too self righteous on this issue, I offer iTunes on windows as exhibit A as to why those in glass houses ought not be throwing stones.

Re: Microsoft launches a PC vs Mac website

#37

Post by statictype »

tptacek wrote: post #3

You know... all snark aside, a lot of these things are true: * Macs get a tiny fraction of the games available to Windows. * Macs really don't have Bluray support. * Macs really are different from Windows, although they are different in arguably a good way, and my mom had no trouble learning them. * Macs really do a crappy job with Word and Excel, and like it or not, and regardless of the degree to which this is MSFT…

Macs also have the advantage of mind-share.

On the other hand, Windows really ought to try and sell the ease of basic UI interactions and Window management, possibly with a screen cast. My experience (probably heretical) has been that being able to move around and resize windows on Windows7 is much easier than on the Mac. Fitt's law is not terribly complicated and explaining it to users and why they need it and why Windows does it better may not be a bad thing.

Edit: They've already partially done that, it looks like.

Re: Microsoft launches a PC vs Mac website

#39

Post by statictype »

Herring wrote: post #23

http://www.apple.com/why-mac/ I don't know about the technical details, but comparing it with the Apple website makes one thing clear: Microsoft has no design sense.

That page does have a better design.

It's a bit funny though that one of the points on a Why-Mac page is that "It can run Windows".

Re: Microsoft launches a PC vs Mac website

#40

Post by statictype »

melling wrote: post #4

9 out of 10 people already use Windows. Are they trying to get that number back up to 9.4 out of 10? I think their efforts are better spent in mobile and building an iPad competitor. It's really going to hurt when Apple and Google lock up the mobile and tablet markets.

>9 out of 10 people already use Windows

Is this really true? I was under the impression that Macs constitute at least 15% of the market (at least in America)

Post reply on HN