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School of Mines Wants to Launch the First Space Mining Program

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Re: School of Mines Wants to Launch the First Space Mining Program

#31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We're great at mining but bad at putting things in space. The main virtue of mining things in space is that the materials are already in space, sparing the vast expense of launching them up there. I guess I partially agree that having other things we want to do in space is prerequisite, but imagine the kinds of things we could do and build if we had unlimited raw materials already in orbit, or on the moon. Remember,…

We are not great at mining. Fun fact: the manufacturing industry has been able to obtain machine utilization at nearly 100%. Mining is in the 40% range.

What's the utilization in the construction industry? I think that'd be a more fair analog for mining.

Re: School of Mines Wants to Launch the First Space Mining Program

#32
Twenty years ago a high school buddy of mine went to Mines, and he came back wearing a t-shirt showing (if memory serves) the earth with big drills all over it and the rest of the planets in the background and the caption read:

"Earth first - we'll get to the other ones later"

Re: School of Mines Wants to Launch the First Space Mining Program

#33

>[T]he class covered the Outer Space Treaty, a creation of the United Nations that governs outer-space actions and (in some people's interpretations) makes the legality of space mining dubious. If this topic interests you, there's a whole category at your local library for Space Law (it's at the end, KZD1002-6715): https://www.loc.gov/aba/cataloging/classification/lcco/lcco_...

There are no governments in space yet so as long as you don't bring the goods back to earth nobody can really say anything.

Re: School of Mines Wants to Launch the First Space Mining Program

#35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We're great at mining but bad at putting things in space. The main virtue of mining things in space is that the materials are already in space, sparing the vast expense of launching them up there. I guess I partially agree that having other things we want to do in space is prerequisite, but imagine the kinds of things we could do and build if we had unlimited raw materials already in orbit, or on the moon. Remember,…

We are not great at mining. Fun fact: the manufacturing industry has been able to obtain machine utilization at nearly 100%. Mining is in the 40% range.

We’re not great at environmentally friendly mining. Mountain top removal mining, open pit mining and strip mining are brute force tactics that demonstrate a capacity for efficiency, but remain controversial because of their destructive qualities.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surface_mining

No one will care about using destructive tactics on an asteroid, freeing everyone’s hand to not be gentle. On the other hand, much of what gets mined in space will need to stay in space. After all, what would happen, if three times the mass of planet earth were mined into managable resources? To add as much to earth’s surface would augment orbit and rotation for starters. Even bringing such mass near earth would wreak havoc on ocean tides.

Re: School of Mines Wants to Launch the First Space Mining Program

#36
post #12

Excluding organic materials like oil/coal/etc the global economy does not spend a lot of resources on mining. Further, we have vast excess supply's of most of what we do mine making space based mining problematic. Sure, it sounds good but we need to be in space for some other reasons before mining becomes practical.

Certainly.

However, spaceflight is getting cheaper by the year and is heading into a significant phase change related to costs. Soon the market will be dominated by partially reusable rockets. After a generation or two of improvements those reusable rockets will drive launch costs down by at least an order of magnitude if not two compared to today. That will make doing anything in space cheaper, and it's a fair bet that you'll see more organizations "doing stuff" (launching payloads) into space as a consequence (in fact, this is already happening).

Additionally, there are follow-on effects, especially when it comes to manned spaceflight. Take the ISS for example. Because it exists it means there is a call for services for it, such as crew transfers (Soyuz, formerly Shuttle, and soon Dragon/CST-100), resupply (Progress, Dragon, HTV, Antares, etc.), and module delivery. Lower cost launches would translate naturally to more activity in Earth orbit and more call for services, leading to a feedback loop of increasing activity. Within 20 years you'll see not just space stations but orbital towns and maybe even cities, as well as industrial establishments where R&D is performed on-orbit. Imagine how much more effective you could be at designing satellites and spacecraft if you had an on orbit environment that you could as a prototype test environment whenever you wanted to at low cost. All of that translates into orders of magnitude more activity in space at orders of magnitude lower marginal costs.

And in that environment, asteroid mining seems pretty sensible, not for service to Earth's surface but for service to on orbit activities. For one the equipment and infrastructure to exploit such resources will be cheaper to put into space due to lower launch costs, lowering the necessary price-point where profit is possible. For another, the customer base will be large and capable of making use of even bulk materials.

In that world, the world of 10, 20, 30+ years from now, asteroid mining will make sound economic sense. But the time to begin pursuing technology development is not 30 years from now, it's today. Building prototypes, figuring out what's possible, learning the early lessons as early as possible at comparatively low cost will give those operators a huge jump as changes bring their business into viability. Especially so in regard to the legal precedents in terms of laying claim to resources. For something that could easily be a trillion dollar a year, or more, industry in 30 years, that's an excellent RoI.

Re: School of Mines Wants to Launch the First Space Mining Program

#37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We are not great at mining. Fun fact: the manufacturing industry has been able to obtain machine utilization at nearly 100%. Mining is in the 40% range.

We’re not great at environmentally friendly mining. Mountain top removal mining, open pit mining and strip mining are brute force tactics that demonstrate a capacity for efficiency, but remain controversial because of their destructive qualities. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surface_mining No one will care about using destructive tactics on an asteroid, freeing everyone’s hand to not be gentle. On the other hand, mu…

> The total mass of the asteroid belt is approximately 4% that of the Moon, or 22% that of Pluto, and roughly twice that of Pluto's moon Charon (whose diameter is 1200 km).

(Wikipedia)

It will take a long time before we have mined enough mass to worry about things like tides.

Re: School of Mines Wants to Launch the First Space Mining Program

#38

>[T]he class covered the Outer Space Treaty, a creation of the United Nations that governs outer-space actions and (in some people's interpretations) makes the legality of space mining dubious. If this topic interests you, there's a whole category at your local library for Space Law (it's at the end, KZD1002-6715): https://www.loc.gov/aba/cataloging/classification/lcco/lcco_...

There are no governments in space yet so as long as you don't bring the goods back to earth nobody can really say anything.

As long as you're personally living on Earth, various governments can, and will, say a lot. Even if you migrate to space permanently, it'll only be a matter of whether it's worth it to launch something after you.

Re: School of Mines Wants to Launch the First Space Mining Program

#39

>[T]he class covered the Outer Space Treaty, a creation of the United Nations that governs outer-space actions and (in some people's interpretations) makes the legality of space mining dubious. If this topic interests you, there's a whole category at your local library for Space Law (it's at the end, KZD1002-6715): https://www.loc.gov/aba/cataloging/classification/lcco/lcco_...

There are no governments in space yet so as long as you don't bring the goods back to earth nobody can really say anything.

There are no governments in the open ocean but maritime law still exists.

Re: School of Mines Wants to Launch the First Space Mining Program

#40
post #12

Excluding organic materials like oil/coal/etc the global economy does not spend a lot of resources on mining. Further, we have vast excess supply's of most of what we do mine making space based mining problematic. Sure, it sounds good but we need to be in space for some other reasons before mining becomes practical.

Can you define what you mean by not spending a lot of resources on Mining? A significant part of the world’s GDP is in mining and mining and its subsidiary industries (manufacturing for example could not exist without mining) contributes something like 60-70% of the world’s GDP. We do not have vast excess supply. There are likely many deposits left to be found but it’s widely accepted that the easy resources have bee…

Linking mining to manufacturing is meaningless. You can manufacture with recicled material. Outside of radioactive material we don't destroy anything else just transform it. Sure, marble for example has nice aesthetics, but we can't get marble from the asteroid belt just basic elements which don't disappear.
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