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China’s AI Awakening

technologyreview.com

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Re: China’s AI Awakening

#31

Post by jacquesm »

exelius wrote: post #23
tw1010 wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I live in a country outside the US (not China) but every time people from the US talk about us they have this same story, which seems to come from US news sources, which is nowhere close to what is actually going on. That makes me wonder, is the same thing going on for China? I keep hearing on HN this same story "China is anti-democratic and anti-innovation, nothing interesting goes on there". But how much of that is…

Americans tend to have difficulty believing that others can possibly have different values. Part of the core of American beliefs is that Democracy is the natural state for all nations; and I'm not sure that's entirely true. It feels like there is a tipping point of population size where an individualistic society just tramples over the tragedy of the commons, and collectivist societies introduce controls and social p…

> Part of the core of American beliefs is that Democracy is the natural state for all nations; and I'm not sure that's entirely true.

And that's funny because if there is something that the US is not it is a democracy. It is at best a partial democracy where votes from different individuals count very different towards the outcome and where there is a huge and concerted effort at the repression of certain groups of voters.

Re: China’s AI Awakening

#33

Post by exelius »

it_learnses wrote: post #22
exelius wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Chinese culture values harmony and stability over individualism and total freedom. The actions of the individual glorify the group; and they view "dictators" as more of a "father-like figurehead". They look at the US and see the problems we have (crime, gun control, health care, etc) and can point to their own society and say "well, we solved all of those so our system is better." Many young Chinese who were educated…

Understandable for Chinese nationals to go back. But for someone like Ng, who was born and educated here, it seems very irresponsible.

You're making an assumption that he didn't feel like China would be a better option for him personally. If he fundamentally disagreed with the direction the US is headed, I wouldn't call it irresponsible at all.

All things considered, the US looks really bad right now internationally. We have vast military power, and our leader is a child elected on a wave of nationalist populism. This has happened before in recent history, and it didn't end well.

Re: China’s AI Awakening

#34

Post by logiclion »

exelius wrote: post #23
tw1010 wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I live in a country outside the US (not China) but every time people from the US talk about us they have this same story, which seems to come from US news sources, which is nowhere close to what is actually going on. That makes me wonder, is the same thing going on for China? I keep hearing on HN this same story "China is anti-democratic and anti-innovation, nothing interesting goes on there". But how much of that is…

Americans tend to have difficulty believing that others can possibly have different values. Part of the core of American beliefs is that Democracy is the natural state for all nations; and I'm not sure that's entirely true. It feels like there is a tipping point of population size where an individualistic society just tramples over the tragedy of the commons, and collectivist societies introduce controls and social p…

I am always genuinely curious about the statement "Americans tend to have difficulty believing that others can possibly have different values". I always think about the different types of cultures and living situations Americans tend to find themselves in and "around" compared to a country such as China who clearly has a clear set of cultural values and norms. It's almost as if having a value system outside of the norm of the Chinese is deemed inherently contrasting where as in America having a different value system is in part of American "culture". How can americans not be aware of different values when topics like gun control, healthcare, education, etc are freely discussed in the open? Are they not representing different values?

Re: China’s AI Awakening

#35

Post by usaar333 »

it_learnses wrote: post #22
exelius wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Chinese culture values harmony and stability over individualism and total freedom. The actions of the individual glorify the group; and they view "dictators" as more of a "father-like figurehead". They look at the US and see the problems we have (crime, gun control, health care, etc) and can point to their own society and say "well, we solved all of those so our system is better." Many young Chinese who were educated…

Understandable for Chinese nationals to go back. But for someone like Ng, who was born and educated here, it seems very irresponsible.

He was born in the UK and grew up in Hong Kong and Singapore. That hardly constitutes "growing up in the West"

Re: China’s AI Awakening

#36

Post by denzil_correa »

it_learnses wrote: post #16

Scientists like Ng ought to consider the repercussions of their actions when they decide to aid Chinese companies, and by extension, the Chinese govt with cutting edge research. They are basically collaborating with the enemy that stands against pretty much everything that the west granted them (scientists like Ng who were born here and given the opportunities).

Does this mean we should all stop using Chinese products like most of the phones made in the USA?

Re: China’s AI Awakening

#37

Post by mljoe »

ericflo wrote: post #3
idibidiart wrote: post #2

Thb, most of the interesting work I've seen has come out of Silicon Valley. What breakthroughs have come from China?

Off the top of my head, didn't ResNet come out of MSRA?

Yes. ResNet was CVPR paper of the year last year. This year DenseNet has a first author from Tsinghua University (Dr. Zhuang Liu). I feel like the importance of China in machine learning is very hard to dispute these days. At least they are open about it, which is good for scientific development worldwide.

Re: China’s AI Awakening

#38

Post by guelo »

ausjke wrote: post #29
exelius wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Chinese culture values harmony and stability over individualism and total freedom. The actions of the individual glorify the group; and they view "dictators" as more of a "father-like figurehead". They look at the US and see the problems we have (crime, gun control, health care, etc) and can point to their own society and say "well, we solved all of those so our system is better." Many young Chinese who were educated…

Not only that, the trend of moving towards leftism in USA, i.e. nation-wide anti-intelligence movement(no-child-left-behind,everyone gets a trophy, merit-based effort is cursed on, AA at universities, each students gets free high-school diploma at CA, removing non-ranking from high schools,etc), basically, USA is shifting from 'equal-opportunity to equal-outcome',fast. That is what China tried for a few decades in th…

Your definition of leftism is a ridiculous. In the article it says that the Chinese government is pouring hundreds of billions of yuan into AI technology. Now thats leftism, and we would be smart to copy it.

Re: China’s AI Awakening

#39

Post by indescions_2017 »

Hmmm. MIT Tech Review now behind cognito-only browser shield? Is that new?

What's really interesting is the continued trend of cashless WeChat Pay adoption in China versus say trickling Digital Payments penetration here in USA. I actually just had to order a new replacement set of paper checks. And its simply due to the fact that so many small merchants cite higher credit card fees as a reason for preferring cash or checks for payments.

Coupled with AI, I think this preference for instant, fee-less digital payments will translate into convenience stores without cashiers. Auto repair shops where you just drop off your faulty electric vehicle and hop into a loaner without actually interacting with a customer service agent. And thousands of other technology-mediated retail experiences.

It's Asian consumer adoption and demand driving AI solutions from the bottom up. And that makes it much more likely to result in first mover advantage and the potential for game-changing breakthroughs.

Re: China’s AI Awakening

#40

Post by bluetwo »

Whenever I read articles like this I'm really looking for the million dollar idea. Solving Go is good. Solving Poker is better. Best would be solving a high-value business problem for which a solution using AI can be developed.
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