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Silicon Valley Is Not Your Friend

nytimes.com

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Re: Silicon Valley Is Not Your Friend

#31

Post by jstanley »

thriftwy wrote: post #23
hprotagonist wrote: post #2

I grew up reading 2600 and the jargon file and early slashdot, and hanging out on freenode and usenet, so i've been indoctrinated in this way of thinking this way for 20 years. In my experience, the people who built the net are among its sharpest and most vocal critics, and there's some cause for that. I'm not sure what the implications of everyone else thinking this way will be.

We knew from the day one that over-reliance on cloud giants like Facebook or Google in holding all your life worth of data is a bad idea. We told everybody that it is a bad idea. Everybody promptly ignored our warnings. Some laughed. I guess they don't laugh anymore, do they? Now, who was right? Obligatory https://xkcd.com/743/

Unfortunately, I think they still mostly laugh.

Re: Silicon Valley Is Not Your Friend

#32

Post by dsfyu404ed »

cmsonger wrote: post #22

"For profit organizations are not your friend" is usually true. It's not restricted to tech companies or silicon valley.

I'd be more general and say "organizations of more than 10 or so people are not capable of being friendly" Sure your interests may align for a possibly indefinite time period and deliver similar results to friendship but the larger a group is the more it acts like a sociopath.

Re: Silicon Valley Is Not Your Friend

#34

Post by mtgx »

qudat wrote: post #27

Who thought tech companies were ever a friend? I don't see a problem with massive corporations so long as they get that way by offering the best good or service at the lowest price (natural monopolies). If they achieve their status by partaking in political activity or otherwise using their power in a coercive manner (coercive monopolies) then that's where I draw the line. There lies the biggest problem with powerful…

Google played a good trick with the whole "Don't be evil" mantra, for as long as it lasted.

Most people used to think Google could do no wrong in the past. I think their image has noticeably gone downhill since they stopped even pretending to abide by that mantra.

As Schmidt realized, too, the mantra allowed Google employees to have a reason for pushing back when they thought something doesn't feel right. So I suppose the Google execs eventually started "de-training" them from thinking about it.

> "Now, when I showed up, I thought this was the stupidest rule ever, because there's no book about evil except maybe, you know, the Bible or something." In the end, though, he believes it has worked, by giving employees a way to point out things they find unethical.

https://www.theverge.com/2013/5/13/4326424/eric-schmidt-once...

Re: Silicon Valley Is Not Your Friend

#36

Post by dclowd9901 »

paulryanrogers wrote: post #29
dclowd9901 wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is my experience as well. While my family are enjoying their Amazon Dots and "Hey Siri" and everything else, I'm constantly reminding them of how evil these companies are, and how they're constantly consuming and eating information, while Uncle Sam syphons every drip of internet off the pipeline. Convenience, in my mind, has never been worth the price of losing anonymity.

How do you maintain your anonymity?

Not tweeting (much), not instagramming (much), not posting on Facebook (much), etc. I don't see anonymity as a binary; more of a spectrum (think something that stretches between a hermit and a celebrity).

Obviously as a human existing into some manner of time with family and friends and coworkers, I'm _known_ by those who could/should, but I don't need Amazon parsing conversations in my kitchen.

Re: Silicon Valley Is Not Your Friend

#37

Post by losvedir »

baron816 wrote: post #8

I'm no fan of Facebook, but I don't get why they're to blame for Russia's meddling in the election. It's hard to believe that they were aware of what was going on and allowed it to continue because they were making money off of it. The money they were getting was a pittance, all things considered.

Even if they knew, I'm still not totally clear on what's wrong with running those ads. It seems everyone has such a low opinion of everyone else these days. I really wish the outcome of learning that Russians bought ads on facebook was a cultural antibody to not believe ads, not a call to ever more closely regulate what stuff people should see.

Re: Silicon Valley Is Not Your Friend

#38

Post by numbsafari »

thriftwy wrote: post #23
hprotagonist wrote: post #2

I grew up reading 2600 and the jargon file and early slashdot, and hanging out on freenode and usenet, so i've been indoctrinated in this way of thinking this way for 20 years. In my experience, the people who built the net are among its sharpest and most vocal critics, and there's some cause for that. I'm not sure what the implications of everyone else thinking this way will be.

We knew from the day one that over-reliance on cloud giants like Facebook or Google in holding all your life worth of data is a bad idea. We told everybody that it is a bad idea. Everybody promptly ignored our warnings. Some laughed. I guess they don't laugh anymore, do they? Now, who was right? Obligatory https://xkcd.com/743/

To be more accurate, the last two panes of that comic would would be set as a FB feed with the first character posting the FB is evil and the second character replying “told you so”.

Re: Silicon Valley Is Not Your Friend

#39

Post by goshx »

dclowd9901 wrote: post #36
paulryanrogers wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do you maintain your anonymity?

Not tweeting (much), not instagramming (much), not posting on Facebook (much), etc. I don't see anonymity as a binary; more of a spectrum (think something that stretches between a hermit and a celebrity). Obviously as a human existing into some manner of time with family and friends and coworkers, I'm _known_ by those who could/should, but I don't need Amazon parsing conversations in my kitchen.

I tend to think that it is not as much about how much you use it. You either do use it or don't. If you do, you are already being tracked.

Re: Silicon Valley Is Not Your Friend

#40

Post by logfromblammo »

baron816 wrote: post #8

I'm no fan of Facebook, but I don't get why they're to blame for Russia's meddling in the election. It's hard to believe that they were aware of what was going on and allowed it to continue because they were making money off of it. The money they were getting was a pittance, all things considered.

So people are angry that a media engine was used as a platform to deliver content designed to sway their opinions and behaviors using various forms of mendacity, exaggeration, obfuscation, prevarication, suggestion, dark psychology, titillation, and propaganda.

Doesn't that describe all advertising?

Also, shouldn't we be slightly happy that US tech companies were able to export US-audience advertising capacity to Russia, even though the dominant social network in Russia is now VKontakte? How much of this is just bellyaching because Facebook is making it too obvious that you are its product and not its customer, by selling its product (you) to foreign (to you) interests?

Russia would not have been able to get impressions for so many so cheaply if the US valued critical thinking skills over the mindless consumerism and status signaling via re-sharing certain types of content.

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