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Interview with Ryan Dahl, Creator of Node.js

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Re: Interview with Ryan Dahl, Creator of Node.js

#31

Post by apparentlymart »

thehardsphere wrote: post #20
amasad wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The fact that Node survives as a platform for Fullstack JavaScript shows how serendipity works in invention: he set out to build a high performance network server and ended up building one of the largest platforms for building web applications. The reasons it ended being very big are clear in hindsight but are hard to predict: - Sharing code between server and client - Server side rendering - Lower barrier to entry t…

What do people mean when they keep saying "server side rendering" in this specific Javascript/Node.js context? I ask because I've seen quite a few people tout that term as a recent innovation. It was my understanding that "server side rendering" was the way the web worked since the beginning, with the server generating the markup that is provided to the browser to render the page. Nobody called it "server side render…

In this context, I think it usually means that the same rendering paths are available on both the client _and_ the server, whereas formerly it was often the case that the server was responsible for the bulk of the rendering and the client just made minor adjustments to the DOM in response to events.

I agree that it's a bit of a misnomer, but I can see why people would call it that given the path we took to get here: first we rendered almost everything on the server, and then it became popular to render everything on the client, but now we're finding that a compromise is best, and that compromise is easiest to achieve when you have similar technology on both sides.

("We" in the above is intended to represent some vague idea of the web development community at large, not any particular individuals or groups.)

Re: Interview with Ryan Dahl, Creator of Node.js

#32

Post by stephenr »

amasad wrote: post #14
jgrahamc wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agree. It takes a lot to walk away from something and say you were wrong. But, sadly, part of the saga of nodejs could have been avoided by people looking at the history of computing. If you look at Go's concurrency model it was entirely mapped out in the 1970s in CSP. There wasn't really any need for go the 'single thread, non-blocking' route that nodejs took and evangelize it as nirvana. There was a ton of distribu…

The fact that Node survives as a platform for Fullstack JavaScript shows how serendipity works in invention: he set out to build a high performance network server and ended up building one of the largest platforms for building web applications. The reasons it ended being very big are clear in hindsight but are hard to predict: - Sharing code between server and client - Server side rendering - Lower barrier to entry t…

I wouldn't call npm "well designed".

It's progres bar was the bottleneck causing slow downs.

The size of node_modules directories is basically a meme now.

Re: Interview with Ryan Dahl, Creator of Node.js

#33

Post by camus2 »

spraak wrote: post #21
erokar wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If you look at Go's concurrency model it was entirely mapped out in the 1970s Isn't that Go's problem, though — that there isn't a single thing in the language that wasn't entierly mapped out in the 1970s?

Using ideas from history isn't a problem. And Go is unique in that it combined all these learned lessons into something new.

> Using ideas from history isn't a problem. And Go is unique in that it combined all these learned lessons into something new.

what learned lessons, like pragmas and struct tags?

Re: Interview with Ryan Dahl, Creator of Node.js

#34

Post by vqc »

amoorthy wrote: post #13

Pretty cool how he took a very unusual career/personal route to become such an important figure in the programming world. Good reminder for a parent like me that getting your kids into a "top" school isn't a must to succeed.

I mean, he went to two "Top 50" schools studying math. Do you mean he didn't go to an Ivy League or a school traditionally known as a top CS school?

Re: Interview with Ryan Dahl, Creator of Node.js

#35

Post by msoad »

dsacco wrote: post #19

I find it interesting that he ended up at Google Brain working on deep learning research after writing Node. There seems to be a trend in the industry of taking people who are exceptional in one area and putting them on AI problems (e.g. Chris Lattner). I wonder how effective that cross pollination is.

A lot of AI is super complicated large software systems and building those don't require academic ML knowledge rather they require knowing how to build good software.

Re: Interview with Ryan Dahl, Creator of Node.js

#36

Post by technofire »

dsacco wrote: post #19

I find it interesting that he ended up at Google Brain working on deep learning research after writing Node. There seems to be a trend in the industry of taking people who are exceptional in one area and putting them on AI problems (e.g. Chris Lattner). I wonder how effective that cross pollination is.

He has two math degrees from decent (R1, AAU) schools, so I wouldn't say it's a huge leap; he probably has better training for modern AI than most people working in the area with CS degrees.

Re: Interview with Ryan Dahl, Creator of Node.js

#39

Post by pier25 »

stephenr wrote: post #32
amasad wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The fact that Node survives as a platform for Fullstack JavaScript shows how serendipity works in invention: he set out to build a high performance network server and ended up building one of the largest platforms for building web applications. The reasons it ended being very big are clear in hindsight but are hard to predict: - Sharing code between server and client - Server side rendering - Lower barrier to entry t…

I wouldn't call npm "well designed". It's progres bar was the bottleneck causing slow downs. The size of node_modules directories is basically a meme now.

I don't think amasad was referring to npm but the module system.
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