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Is Handwriting History?

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Re: Is Handwriting History?

#31

Post by WalterBright »

toomanybeersies wrote: post #21

I find that the more time I spend around computers, the more I actually want to hand write things. I've recently gotten into the habit of keeping notebooks for various things, I even wrote a letter by hand to someone (something I haven't done since I was a child). There's something so permanent about handwriting, compared to an ephemeral computer file. There's also the fact that notebooks don't run out of battery, or…

I've spent many hours attempting to transcribe my grandparents' handwritten letters. It's very difficult to decipher. Ironically, even the letters they'd mash out on a typewriter are difficult to decipher, but it's a lot easier than the handwriting.

It's not just my grandparents. Their relatives also all had wretched handwriting. I've shown them to many people, and they can hardly make it out, either.

I don't think good penmanship was commonplace :-)

Re: Is Handwriting History?

#32

Post by WalterBright »

ylere wrote: post #17

I always carry a pocket sized notebook and a pen with me wherever I go. It's still the fastest method to write something down, it always works and it's socially acceptable to use in all situations. Most people whom I meet, even in private, will see me take out my notebook at the beging of the meeting, taking notes occasionally while we interact. I don't think you could do that with a computer or phone and it allows m…

I take notes on paper, and then scan them in later. I get the best of both worlds that way.

Re: Is Handwriting History?

#33

Post by WalterBright »

cooper12 wrote: post #16
TeMPOraL wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You must be a very slow typist :). I can write on a keyboard much faster than on paper, and I'll bet I can outpace any regular person in this way. One could try and compete by employing some stenography shenanigans, but at that point I'll just enable abbrev mode in my Emacs and beat them again. Where typing fails me, though, is anything other than writing regular, linear text. The moment I expect needing to write a l…

> Writing by hand is amazingly flexible Once, as an exercise I attempted to transcribe my Statistics notes into LaTeX. I was perfectly capable of inserting the proper math notation, but I never realized how versatile layouts can be so easily made on paper. Things like alternating writing sizes (doable in digital, but usually ends up looking horrible), varying levels of indentation and line height, margin notes, aside…

Too bad digital notes don't have coffee rings and chocolate stains on them.

Re: Is Handwriting History?

#34

Post by sseagull »

WalterBright wrote: post #31
toomanybeersies wrote: post #21

I find that the more time I spend around computers, the more I actually want to hand write things. I've recently gotten into the habit of keeping notebooks for various things, I even wrote a letter by hand to someone (something I haven't done since I was a child). There's something so permanent about handwriting, compared to an ephemeral computer file. There's also the fact that notebooks don't run out of battery, or…

I've spent many hours attempting to transcribe my grandparents' handwritten letters. It's very difficult to decipher. Ironically, even the letters they'd mash out on a typewriter are difficult to decipher, but it's a lot easier than the handwriting. It's not just my grandparents. Their relatives also all had wretched handwriting. I've shown them to many people, and they can hardly make it out, either. I don't think g…

This isn't the first time I've said this, but I believe doing serious genealogy will 'cure' most people of their love of cursive, and maybe writing things by hand in general.

You get better at reading it, but there is much more bad handwriting out there than good.

Re: Is Handwriting History?

#35

Post by jtarb1 »

The Summer Institute of Linguistics site outside Tucson keeps many of the many languages spoken in Mexico in a room with no vents. The fear is that if a fire occurs, the documents with the writing kept within will be lost. I would include those in history, but I am not a purist so much that I consider that language doesn't evolve.

Re: Is Handwriting History?

#36

Post by taesis »

Not sure if it bothered anyone else enough to look, but I tracked down the missing source for the header image [1]. The U.S. Declaration of Independence [2] is another nice example of handwriting, but unlike a random, faded (and potential non-English?) recipe, it seems very legible and might not have helped the author's argument.

[1]: https://www.flickr.com/photos/calliope/5094055919/in/gallery...

[2]: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/8f/United_S...

edit: Phrasing

Re: Is Handwriting History?

#37

Post by jonnycomputer »

TeMPOraL wrote: post #10
sametmax wrote: post #8

Taking note is still faster in with a pen and paper. Thinking as well. And I'm on the very upper scale of computer skills. Lately I even removed some part of my project management tooling to replace it with paper. Very short term actionable data is more productive on paper for me.

You must be a very slow typist :). I can write on a keyboard much faster than on paper, and I'll bet I can outpace any regular person in this way. One could try and compete by employing some stenography shenanigans, but at that point I'll just enable abbrev mode in my Emacs and beat them again. Where typing fails me, though, is anything other than writing regular, linear text. The moment I expect needing to write a l…

let's see you write out complex equations with equal facility.

Re: Is Handwriting History?

#38

Post by WalterBright »

sseagull wrote: post #34
WalterBright wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've spent many hours attempting to transcribe my grandparents' handwritten letters. It's very difficult to decipher. Ironically, even the letters they'd mash out on a typewriter are difficult to decipher, but it's a lot easier than the handwriting. It's not just my grandparents. Their relatives also all had wretched handwriting. I've shown them to many people, and they can hardly make it out, either. I don't think g…

This isn't the first time I've said this, but I believe doing serious genealogy will 'cure' most people of their love of cursive, and maybe writing things by hand in general. You get better at reading it, but there is much more bad handwriting out there than good.

With all this work on facial recognition, voice transcription, etc., I'd love to see some AI work on decoding handwriting. It would be a great boon to me.

Re: Is Handwriting History?

#39

Post by JoshTriplett »

WalterBright wrote: post #33
cooper12 wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Writing by hand is amazingly flexible Once, as an exercise I attempted to transcribe my Statistics notes into LaTeX. I was perfectly capable of inserting the proper math notation, but I never realized how versatile layouts can be so easily made on paper. Things like alternating writing sizes (doable in digital, but usually ends up looking horrible), varying levels of indentation and line height, margin notes, aside…

Too bad digital notes don't have coffee rings and chocolate stains on them.

http://hanno-rein.de/archives/349

Re: Is Handwriting History?

#40

Post by Baeocystin »

jrimbault wrote: post #14
tnecniv wrote: post #5

I always carry a pen. I prefer handwriting to taking electronic notes and have never found a touch device I'd rather write on than paper. Aside: Teaching kids cursive also still has value in teaching fine motor skills.

> Aside: Teaching kids cursive also still has value in teaching fine motor skills. IMO, it's the most important thing, we have to teach fine motor skills very early to little humans if we want them to be full humans.

It certainly helped me. I struggled with fine motor control as a kid, and it wasn't until a teacher sat me down and made me practice my penmanship over and over again that I got over the hump.

I won't say I enjoyed it at the time, but as far as 'educational events I can point to and say this made a difference', it is, perhaps surprisingly, quite high on the list.

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