Live data from Hacker News

Why You Should Hire an Old Programmer

joshondesign.com

31–40 of 192 posts

Re: Why You Should Hire an Old Programmer

#31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Uh, isn't that rather much the point? Once a young person learns all this stuff from experience, they've become an old person.

But you can gain experience without necessarily becoming old at the same time. They're correlated, but not causal.

I enjoy your attempt to use "it's not the years it's the mileage" but your assertion that there is some way to gain "experience" without "time" doesn't make a lot of sense.

Re: Why You Should Hire an Old Programmer

#32
post #8

How do older programmers deal with coding interviews from companies like facebook / google? i feel like those advantage people who just finished their algorithms class, or have time to practice specifically for it.

Don't want to generalize but as far as I have seen; they don't. As a 6th point in his list could be; connections. I (42 y/o) know people; I can get programmers to follow me if I move company which is a plus. But I also know investors, potential clients, C*O's and hiring managers. People recommend you or know you via their network.

> I can get programmers to follow me if I move company which is a plus.

It's at best a 'neutral' because when you inevitably leave again you'll take all those people with you potentially leaving the company floundering.

Re: Why You Should Hire an Old Programmer

#33

I would _never_ hire this candidate, based on seeing this. So - the author says that he has "developed some good communication skills". Great! Moving on, let's look at his linkedin page. Quotes from past jobs: "even after our idiot (now ex) CEO canceled the platform.", "wonky JavaEE stuff.". So, as a hiring manager, from this post + linkedin, I now know that this guy: 1) can reach large audiences, 2) trashes past job…

This is indeed basic psychology [1]: talking bad about other people reflects poorly on _you_, not just the people you're talking about.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emotional_contagion

Re: Why You Should Hire an Old Programmer

#34

I would _never_ hire this candidate, based on seeing this. So - the author says that he has "developed some good communication skills". Great! Moving on, let's look at his linkedin page. Quotes from past jobs: "even after our idiot (now ex) CEO canceled the platform.", "wonky JavaEE stuff.". So, as a hiring manager, from this post + linkedin, I now know that this guy: 1) can reach large audiences, 2) trashes past job…

[deleted]

Re: Why You Should Hire an Old Programmer

#35

When talking with young programmers I too often think "well, you are doing that wrong, been there, done that". They don't want to listen. A couple of months later they notice that the gray beard ones were right. From a company perspective, that's just too late, as the money loss is not recoverable. There is nothing wrong with being a young one with no experience. There is so much wrong when a company has only a bunch…

Conversely I find that a number of the old(er) programmers I've worked with are incredibly stubborn and bigoted. They refuse to see anything from another persons perspective especially if that person is young. As well refusing to keep up with 'modern' technologies and paradigms because "that's not how I'm used to doing it". It's a lot of the "I've been round the block a few times I know what I'm doing" bullshit attitude.

But obviously that's a generalisation. Just like your comment is.

Re: Why You Should Hire an Old Programmer

#36
To be honest, as a middle aged folk I find it impossible to relate with ping pong culture and open space offices. On the other hand, cubicles here are too often signal of brick & mortar ways to intend business, which ultimately means losing value. That's why I think older folks like me should really get into contracting or external consulting. As an alternative, do with finding a job at utilities or other non-cyclic ventures, they always seem eager to listen to juvenile-but-not-disruptive folks to innovate just a bit, not too much, not too fast.

Re: Why You Should Hire an Old Programmer

#37
post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

(1) You don't make legal cases against people involved in a hiring rejection, you make a case against a company. (2) If you are making hiring decisions the appearance of random blog posts should not and will not give you any legal basis not to hire. Legality is encoded in the law, not in blogposts, especially not in blogposts by random passers by. If you were using this as a reason not to hire the person writing the…

> (1) You don't make legal cases against people involved in a hiring rejection, you make a case against a company. Entirely true. In my defense, I'm not a lawyer. Technically also in my defense: the United States has a bad habit of calling corporations people. > (2) If you are making hiring decisions the appearance of random blog posts should not and will not give you any legal basis not to hire. Legality is encoded…

> if someone is likely to cause the firm to be responsible for illegal conduct

HR policies are what takes care of that, if an individual is able to make the company engage in illegal behavior you have bigger problems in the oversight department. Hiring comes with a bunch of rules, this person should not be able to transcend those rules by their lonesome.

Re: Why You Should Hire an Old Programmer

#38

I would _never_ hire this candidate, based on seeing this. So - the author says that he has "developed some good communication skills". Great! Moving on, let's look at his linkedin page. Quotes from past jobs: "even after our idiot (now ex) CEO canceled the platform.", "wonky JavaEE stuff.". So, as a hiring manager, from this post + linkedin, I now know that this guy: 1) can reach large audiences, 2) trashes past job…

This is indeed basic psychology [1]: talking bad about other people reflects poorly on _you_, not just the people you're talking about. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emotional_contagion

[deleted]

Re: Why You Should Hire an Old Programmer

#39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't want to generalize but as far as I have seen; they don't. As a 6th point in his list could be; connections. I (42 y/o) know people; I can get programmers to follow me if I move company which is a plus. But I also know investors, potential clients, C*O's and hiring managers. People recommend you or know you via their network.

> I can get programmers to follow me if I move company which is a plus. It's at best a 'neutral' because when you inevitably leave again you'll take all those people with you potentially leaving the company floundering.

You could read it that way indeed; I meant it like; I know a lot of coders who will join me if they are looking for something new.

And unlike a lot of people it seems, I don't really enjoy moving to another company or taking people if they enjoy what they do; it would be that they would ask me first if I have something.

Re: Why You Should Hire an Old Programmer

#40

I would _never_ hire this candidate, based on seeing this. So - the author says that he has "developed some good communication skills". Great! Moving on, let's look at his linkedin page. Quotes from past jobs: "even after our idiot (now ex) CEO canceled the platform.", "wonky JavaEE stuff.". So, as a hiring manager, from this post + linkedin, I now know that this guy: 1) can reach large audiences, 2) trashes past job…

Quoting a previous reply to this thread which was deleted (so I'll omit the commenter's name):

> I don't think it's so bad. Sometimes, you work with idiots.

Just because a person thinks coworkers are idiots doesn't mean the person should pipe up about it. It's one of those communication skills that a person with a ton of experience is expected to learn.

Post reply on HN