Live data from Hacker News

The Rise and Fall of Yik Yak

nytimes.com

31–40 of 145 posts

Re: The Rise and Fall of Yik Yak

#31
post #16

Honestly, I don't get all the complaining from harassment. We live in a digital age where we can control a large amount of our information stream. If we don't like something, we just turn off the stream. It's like left-wing advocates and Fox. They don't like it, so they don't watch it. If you don't like what people are posting on some service, remove the service, inform people you know that you don't care about what'…

How do you turn off real life though? These online streams aren't limited to existing just online. They spill over into the real world.

Why do you think bomb threats shouldn't be taken seriously? What about death threats? What about threats to do you bodily harm? When they start to harass you in the real world, where do you draw the line? At what point do you stop taking things seriously?

And before you brush all this off as "Of course that shouldn't be allowed" that's literally what is being discussed here, and you completely missed it.

Re: The Rise and Fall of Yik Yak

#32
post #16

Honestly, I don't get all the complaining from harassment. We live in a digital age where we can control a large amount of our information stream. If we don't like something, we just turn off the stream. It's like left-wing advocates and Fox. They don't like it, so they don't watch it. If you don't like what people are posting on some service, remove the service, inform people you know that you don't care about what'…

My thoughts exactly. I don't like the idea of a culture where it's ok to think "you're saying things I don't like, so you should be banned from saying it completely". its unhealthy and causes more harm the more it's permitted.

> its unhealthy and causes more harm the more it's permitted

Interestingly enough, that's something that's even more true about sites for anonymous smearing of people in your local community.

Re: The Rise and Fall of Yik Yak

#33
post #16

Honestly, I don't get all the complaining from harassment. We live in a digital age where we can control a large amount of our information stream. If we don't like something, we just turn off the stream. It's like left-wing advocates and Fox. They don't like it, so they don't watch it. If you don't like what people are posting on some service, remove the service, inform people you know that you don't care about what'…

> But maybe I'm wrong. Maybe I'm missing something

Post your name and address here, and give me 72 hours to show you what the harassment being complained about is like.

Re: The Rise and Fall of Yik Yak

#34

The article makes the case (to me) that local + anonymous was a failed experiment. In real-life communities, local means not anonymous, and bad behavior -- which is rare whether anonymous or not -- can be tied to an individual right away. The problem is that nasty, anonymous, and local is a terrible combination: > That hyper-localization is also what made the cases of harassment particularly galling. Ms. Musick, one…

> The article makes the case (to me) that local + anonymous was a failed experiment.

Jodel, a German YikYak clone, is still alive and well – in fact, doing better than ever.

Might be due to different environments, different moderation approaches, but it works.

Re: The Rise and Fall of Yik Yak

#35
post #20
post #16

Honestly, I don't get all the complaining from harassment. We live in a digital age where we can control a large amount of our information stream. If we don't like something, we just turn off the stream. It's like left-wing advocates and Fox. They don't like it, so they don't watch it. If you don't like what people are posting on some service, remove the service, inform people you know that you don't care about what'…

[flagged]

some people don't want to live in a world where that sort of aggressive behaviour goes unchecked. whether it affects you or not personally, it's still a negative effect that we can look to minimize.

"bullying" takes on many forms, and while I tend to think that just words alone may not necessarily cause harm, I've seen it escalate to physical violence enough that it makes me want to nip it in the bud earlier rather than later.

Re: The Rise and Fall of Yik Yak

#36
post #24
post #16

Honestly, I don't get all the complaining from harassment. We live in a digital age where we can control a large amount of our information stream. If we don't like something, we just turn off the stream. It's like left-wing advocates and Fox. They don't like it, so they don't watch it. If you don't like what people are posting on some service, remove the service, inform people you know that you don't care about what'…

Sure. I'm sure that people are saying all sorts of bad things about Mirimir. And about my other personas. And about my meatspace identity. But I don't go out of my way to read that stuff. Any more than I go out of my way to read media that seems stupid. However, I do get the concern about anonymous online mobs. If you're targeted heavily online, it's possible that someone will act out violently. Like that guy who sho…

Just last night I saw a message scrawled on a bathroom wall that said, "for a good time, call Mirimir."

Don't know if that's good or bad from your perspective, but I chuckled at the old school hyperlocal anonymity of it.

Re: The Rise and Fall of Yik Yak

#38

The article makes the case (to me) that local + anonymous was a failed experiment. In real-life communities, local means not anonymous, and bad behavior -- which is rare whether anonymous or not -- can be tied to an individual right away. The problem is that nasty, anonymous, and local is a terrible combination: > That hyper-localization is also what made the cases of harassment particularly galling. Ms. Musick, one…

I'm not sure this is entirely fair. YikYak's undoing was doing away with the features that brought people to it; it was a very popular application, and continued to be right up until the de-anonymizing aspects were brought into play. It's function a digital bathroom wall was pretty well executed and in most cases, seemingly a success for interaction. It wasn't really good for anything else besides shitposting, but it definitely was something that people wanted.

I was working at a University in the heyday of YikYak and yes, there were bad posts. Since it was tech related, our administration asked my department to keep an eye on it, but for our school (4500 some students), the attitude was more moderate than it was abusive. Threatening or harassing Yaks were almost always down-voted off the app before we'd even have a chance to see it.

Obviously, other institutions didn't have the same luck that we did, but from my point of view, there was a very good moderation system in place from YikYak - sure, anyone could post something anonymously that was malicious and hateful - but it was incredibly easy to clear it from YikYak.

The student body also took a huge interest in making sure that YikYak stayed in the spirit of anonymous; lot of articles in the student paper about it, lot of rants on the random Facebook Confess pages, and YikYak itself was filled with comments about keeping "stupid shit" off of it. Did some kids still post stupid stuff? Sure, but the rest were more inclined to help with the upkeep.

Re: The Rise and Fall of Yik Yak

#39

The article makes the case (to me) that local + anonymous was a failed experiment. In real-life communities, local means not anonymous, and bad behavior -- which is rare whether anonymous or not -- can be tied to an individual right away. The problem is that nasty, anonymous, and local is a terrible combination: > That hyper-localization is also what made the cases of harassment particularly galling. Ms. Musick, one…

I wouldn't say we know it's useful or not. It went to profiles with handles and profile pictures. It lost its appeal when it did that. That's was when my community jumped ship to Jodel.

Re: The Rise and Fall of Yik Yak

#40
This article seems to miss the point of why Yik Yak really failed. It didn't fail because of bullying, or bad publicity - That doesn't discourage users from using the app unless they're the ones targeted. The app failed because of the ham fisted attempts to control the userbase and remove a problem that did not affect the vast, vast majority of the userbase by introducing the "Handles" feature, and then later making it non-optional.

I'm not even sure if this was a response to harassment, at the time it almost seemed like a pivot for the company - To become the next Snapchat or Facebook, sell targeted ads, and become what every other social company does. This was not what users wanted. It was the only place where people could truly make their thoughts heard without fearing social backlash, which is an issue of incredible importance for University students. And being able to talk with people of a similar age from your University was the perfect gauge for all those things you might want to say but can't. And the handles feature completely removed that. It became extremely easy to tie a person to a handle (Simply watch them while they've got the app open!). There was clear and immediate backlash and people started uninstalling the app en-masse, even posting on the platform about why they were doing so. Yik Yak reversed the update but the damage had already been done - People didn't trust the company to make the right decision any more, and the majority of users never reinstalled.

Note that I'm not saying harassment was good and that the company should have just thrown their hands up in the air and done nothing - The change marking offensive language was welcome, and responding to geo-fence requests in problem areas was fine. But the article fails to mention that the community moderation is incredibly effective. Stupid and offensive yaks were removed quickly through the power of the community - It only took 5 people to say "I don't like this" and you could remove a post.

Perhaps where I was (A small university in the north east of England), we didn't feel any real harassment. People posted racist and homophobic things occasionally, but these posts were quickly removed. Changes to the apps main functionality and appeal came overnight and surprised many people. They now hated the app, aimed at removing a problem that simply didn't exist in the community.

RIP Yik Yak. I'll miss you.

Post reply on HN