> String theorist Lubos Motl savaged Verlinde’s ideas in a recent blog post: “I wouldn’t okay this wrong piece of work as an undergraduate term paper.” I find this rudeness and pedantry in academia infuriating. There's no justification for this level of nastiness -- not in private, public, peer review, or science as a whole. Seeking out the unknown and creative explanations thereof is the hallmark of good science; ch…
> I find this rudeness and pedantry in academia infuriating. So you'd rather people quietly knife you in review? Because that's what happens if you penalize people for public rudeness. Personally, I'd rather have a loud critique to my face than a polite one behind my back or, even worse, no engagement at all. I don't need your politeness or friendship when I'm putting forth some new theory. I need accurate, engaged c…
First test of rival to Einstein’s gravity kills off dark matter
31–40 of 87 posts
Re: First test of rival to Einstein’s gravity kills off dark matter
#32> String theorist Lubos Motl savaged Verlinde’s ideas in a recent blog post: “I wouldn’t okay this wrong piece of work as an undergraduate term paper.” I find this rudeness and pedantry in academia infuriating. There's no justification for this level of nastiness -- not in private, public, peer review, or science as a whole. Seeking out the unknown and creative explanations thereof is the hallmark of good science; ch…
I'm frankly surprised New Scientist bothered to quote him.
Re: First test of rival to Einstein’s gravity kills off dark matter
#33Earlier quoted context omitted.
That says MOND is a non-theory, so now I'm even more confused since this theory "builds on" MOND.
Now I'm confused. What is a non-theory? O.o Theories by definition, may not be correct. It's still a theory. How does one become a non-theorist? I suppose by non-theorizing.
I'm not sure if that's the objection here. They might also be calling it too vague to be a theory, or something else.
Re: First test of rival to Einstein’s gravity kills off dark matter
#34Folks, the observation doesn't test Verlinde's idea, this tests a very general class of models, such as the well-known MOND scheme. > Milgrom, however, supports the work. He also points out that according to his own 2013 analysis of gravitational lensing data in galaxies, MOND produces similarly impressive results as Verlinde’s gravitational model does in Brouwer’s study. (Also: http://motls.blogspot.ca/2016/11/verli…
Seems like it's pretty easy to make dark matter a good fit, because you can just adjust the presumed distribution of dark matter to fit the data.
Re: First test of rival to Einstein’s gravity kills off dark matter
#35Folks, the observation doesn't test Verlinde's idea, this tests a very general class of models, such as the well-known MOND scheme. > Milgrom, however, supports the work. He also points out that according to his own 2013 analysis of gravitational lensing data in galaxies, MOND produces similarly impressive results as Verlinde’s gravitational model does in Brouwer’s study. (Also: http://motls.blogspot.ca/2016/11/verli…
Seems like it's pretty easy to make dark matter a good fit, because you can just adjust the presumed distribution of dark matter to fit the data.
Re: First test of rival to Einstein’s gravity kills off dark matter
#36Folks, the observation doesn't test Verlinde's idea, this tests a very general class of models, such as the well-known MOND scheme. > Milgrom, however, supports the work. He also points out that according to his own 2013 analysis of gravitational lensing data in galaxies, MOND produces similarly impressive results as Verlinde’s gravitational model does in Brouwer’s study. (Also: http://motls.blogspot.ca/2016/11/verli…
http://www.forbes.com/sites/startswithabang/2016/11/12/ask-e...
"The hope is, with the right assumptions, a full theory of gravity, That's the big hope, and what Verlinde is working towards. (Others are also working towards it independently.) This paper is an update on how it's going. So, how's it going?
"There are some successes given very specific assumptions, but there are a lot of problems. The largest problem, quite simply, is that one needs to make a multitude of seemingly arbitrary "interpretation" decisions to wind up with something other than nonsense. For example: the full motivation for this approach is based in anti-de Sitter space (or space with a negative cosmological constant), but our Universe is observed to have a positive cosmological constant (i.e., de Sitter space), and the mathematics of the two spaces have very different properties. For another, you need the entropy to obey a strict area-based law to get the Einstein equations out, but you don't get a cosmological horizon out if you do. (And our Universe has one.) And finally, if you make all the assumptions you need to in order to get the gravitational acceleration for galaxies out, you destroy all of General Relativity's successes on larger-than-galaxy scales. (Verlinde, on pp. 39-40, makes the argument that it could succeed, but the observations of colliding galaxy clusters completely undermine his line of thought.)"
There's even more discussion in the Ethan's article, which is much more balanced.
And another take on Verlinde's paper by Sabine Hossenfelder:
http://backreaction.blogspot.co.at/2016/12/can-dark-energy-a...
"General Relativity is a rigorously tested theory with many achievements. To do any better than general relativity is hard, and thus for any new theory of gravity the most important thing is to have a controlled limit in which General Relativity is reproduced to good precision. How this might work in Verlinde’s approach isn’t clear to me because he doesn’t even attempt to deal with the general case. He starts right away with cosmology."
"I'd say he takes inspiration from models that are best understood in AdS." but "he starts with de-Sitter space which means he assumes dark energy. It doesn't make sense to say that this is a source of dark energy, it's the same thing, period."
Re: First test of rival to Einstein’s gravity kills off dark matter
#37'Kills off dark matter" is probably overstating the case, but I love this theory because it ties together a lot of big ideas. Verlinde's paper is here: https://arxiv.org/abs/1611.02269
What about the Bullet Cluster[0]? How does his idea address that? His idea deserves some study but a title will "Kills off dark matter" is very infuriating [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bullet_Cluster
Re: First test of rival to Einstein’s gravity kills off dark matter
#38> String theorist Lubos Motl savaged Verlinde’s ideas in a recent blog post: “I wouldn’t okay this wrong piece of work as an undergraduate term paper.” I find this rudeness and pedantry in academia infuriating. There's no justification for this level of nastiness -- not in private, public, peer review, or science as a whole. Seeking out the unknown and creative explanations thereof is the hallmark of good science; ch…
Re: First test of rival to Einstein’s gravity kills off dark matter
#39Suggest "Astronomers studying galaxy mass distribution say their observations can be explained without dark matter."
Re: First test of rival to Einstein’s gravity kills off dark matter
#40I'd be kind of bummed to lose dark matter as a concept. I want to hold onto the idea that it's just as rich as our matter, with its own quantum chromodynamics and an equivalent to the electromagnetic force, leading to a "shadow" universe with their own planets, life, etc. that exists side by side us, trying to figure out why their gravity measurements are just slightly off...
It isn't too difficult to formulate a mathematical system where two subsets are completely identical when considered in isolation, but when interacting, one subset operates as if the other doesn't exist, while the other is easily perturbed by any values in the mirror subset. I'm not sure if you can do it without at least one dimensional basis unit that squares to zero, though.
Imagine, if you will, that there are dark-matter people. We have no evidence whatsoever that they exist, any they are constantly annoyed by all the real-matter people that wander between their dark-couches and dark-televisions, and the real-matter bicyclists that pedal through their dark-bedrooms at the worst possible times.