Why Your Excellent Conference Talk Was Rejected • Hacker News Board

Re: Why Your Excellent Conference Talk Was Rejected

#31

Post by eganist » Mon, Oct 17, 2016, 4:09 PM UTC

krschultz wrote: post #28

eganist wrote: post #26

> Heartbreaker #4 – The N00b > [...] > This presentation would have been accepted if we had seen speaker talked at local meetup groups, had a recorded presentation we could view, or maintained a blog so that we could foresee of how he would present his ideas and build an argument. Perhaps we were outliers, but @buu700 and I were accepted to BlackHat and DEF CON with no prior speaking experience outside from a dry run…

Had you presented to the meetup before applying or only after you knew that you were accepted in the conference? Even having done a talk once is far better than most applications.

Delivered it deliberately in preparation for a submission (i.e. before we even submitted the talks but knowing full well that that would be the end goal). Both the talk and delivery were engineered with those audiences in mind, so we restricted recording and distribution of the talk at the prior OWASP meetup until after it was published at BH/DC.

It didn't go all that smoothly at DEF CON (which I'll freely attribute to us both being conference noobs), but it went pretty well overall, all things considered.

Don't know if we'll have anything interesting to talk about next year, but I'm looking forward to potentially doing it again.

Re: Why Your Excellent Conference Talk Was Rejected

#32

Post by eganist » Mon, Oct 17, 2016, 4:13 PM UTC

BJBBB wrote: post #16

Have done reviews for IEEE, APEC, and ACM stuff. There can be many reasons that a presentation is not accepted. Some rejects are a simple instance of subject matter not matching the scope of the symposium. Or there can be some problems with the math and other technical issues. Another unfortunate and not uncomman issue is where the English syntax and/or grammar is so poor that the meaning of the proposal is lost. And…

> So a rejected presentation proposal may not have necessarily been a poor idea. Please do not take rejections personally.

There's also the case of having too many good talks and simply having to tailor the conference around a specific track of talks that might make the most sense for a given audience or for a given industry focus.

Re: Why Your Excellent Conference Talk Was Rejected

#33

Post by erikb » Mon, Oct 17, 2016, 4:16 PM UTC

mivok wrote: post #22

A lot of the comments here are complaining about the last point in the article (the n00b), asking how on earth you get started if you have to have presented before in order to present. The article is telling you exactly how to do that: - Speak at local user group meetings. Most of my local meet ups are constantly calling for speakers, and it's an excellent way to get practice at presenting in a lower stress environme…

I think it' funny that there is so much criticism about that point considering that the blog post already shows how to gain these experience points without actually having talked at conferences (by making a video, by presenting at events with lower requirements, like a meetup).

Re: Why Your Excellent Conference Talk Was Rejected

#34

Post by timtadh » Mon, Oct 17, 2016, 4:20 PM UTC

Honestly, applying to speak at industry conferences is a very frustrating experience. I have given lots of talks at my university, I have spoken at local meetups, and at one local free conference where the organizers knew me. Students and other attendees at my talks often tell me that my talks are good. However, trying to break into the "conference" circuit has been difficult as I have never gotten any direct feedback from anywhere I have submitted to and often wonder if they read my proposal at all. They sometimes even forget to inform you that your talk has not been accepted! It is a bit ridiculous.

In contrast, while I don't want to paint a rosy picture of academic conferences, you always get detailed feedback on your paper/talk that you submit. It may be biased, it may be frustrating, but at least you can tell that someone at least looked at your paper/talk and gave you some feedback. Industry conferences never do this.

Re: Why Your Excellent Conference Talk Was Rejected

#35

Post by mgkimsal » Mon, Oct 17, 2016, 4:29 PM UTC

mivok wrote: post #22

A lot of the comments here are complaining about the last point in the article (the n00b), asking how on earth you get started if you have to have presented before in order to present. The article is telling you exactly how to do that: - Speak at local user group meetings. Most of my local meet ups are constantly calling for speakers, and it's an excellent way to get practice at presenting in a lower stress environme…

I'd probably add "go niche on your topic" as well. While it may put off some selection folks because it's too narrow, it can also work in your favor. I've been selected for conferences precisely because of somewhat niche topics. Now... whether anyone shows up for your talk or not... different story, but if they do, it's a signal that people may want more of that, and it feeds back to organizers.

Re: Why Your Excellent Conference Talk Was Rejected

#36

Post by Roboprog » Mon, Oct 17, 2016, 4:30 PM UTC

ohjeez wrote: post #27

mivok wrote: post #22

A lot of the comments here are complaining about the last point in the article (the n00b), asking how on earth you get started if you have to have presented before in order to present. The article is telling you exactly how to do that: - Speak at local user group meetings. Most of my local meet ups are constantly calling for speakers, and it's an excellent way to get practice at presenting in a lower stress environme…

> Submit to smaller, more focused or more local conferences. You can't expect to be accepted at huge popular conferences speaking in front of hundreds of people on your first try. Submitting to more focused conferences gives you a better chance of being accepted. And also it lets you make a fool of yourself with a smaller audience. Very few people are good at something the first time they try it. Why do you imagine y…

A point not to be underestimated. It's a good place to take up ad-hoc stuff, or try something that you yourself are pretty new at.

Not that I am ever likely to speak at a conference.

Re: Why Your Excellent Conference Talk Was Rejected

#37

Post by Roboprog » Mon, Oct 17, 2016, 4:37 PM UTC

It can be difficult to get "hard data" about a topic, as most of us certainly don't have that available in our day to day work. The best you can hope for is to find somebody else's academic research, and then riff on it in an understandable, enjoyable, manner, I guess.

Re: Why Your Excellent Conference Talk Was Rejected

#38

Post by Etzos » Mon, Oct 17, 2016, 4:42 PM UTC

delinka wrote: post #14

Etzos wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It looks like a blog would also suffice. Although I had the same initial reaction: it feels like a rather overzealous exclusion.

You don't just drop someone without presentation experience onto a stage in front of hundreds or thousands with a laptop and a projector. That's a great way to get negative reviews for the conference from the attendees. Much like you don't hire someone with no experience writing software to come in a write you a brand new point-of-sale system for your chain of a thousand stores just because they're enthusiastic.

I think you're making an assumption that I disagree with the conclusion of the article when in reality, I don't. My initial reaction was that it was overly exclusive and in a way, it is. They don't give a chance to those with no experience doing this kind of thing, which makes the bar for someone with no experience that much higher.

However, I don't think this is wrong, especially for such a large conference. If this were a smaller conference then I think it would actually be overzealous, but that is not what I think in this case, which is why I said it was only my initial reaction.

I would also like to add that the example summary given shows more than just enthusiasm, it shows knowledge of topic as well as the ability to convey that information in a concise and reasonable way. So, a more apt comparison would be not hiring said person to build your brand new POS system just because their academics were good and make a nice resume (just without job experience).

Re: Why Your Excellent Conference Talk Was Rejected

#39

Post by rkangel » Mon, Oct 17, 2016, 4:43 PM UTC

imron wrote: post #3

I like the spinning cogs in the background.

It was a lovely design idea, but I found it distracting as I was reading. A bit like how a running video elsewhere on the page draws the eye, the cogs moving as I scrolled distracted from the text.

If they just were behind the title and opening paragraph, they would scroll out of view relatively quickly. You'd get the nice effect, but stop being distracted.

Re: Why Your Excellent Conference Talk Was Rejected

#40

Post by herge » Mon, Oct 17, 2016, 4:47 PM UTC

mivok wrote: post #22

A lot of the comments here are complaining about the last point in the article (the n00b), asking how on earth you get started if you have to have presented before in order to present. The article is telling you exactly how to do that: - Speak at local user group meetings. Most of my local meet ups are constantly calling for speakers, and it's an excellent way to get practice at presenting in a lower stress environme…

> - Speak at local user group meetings. Most of my local meet ups are constantly calling for speakers

Our local python user group regularly attracts 100+ people crowds and they always have space for speakers. If you want to try dipping your toe, it's hard to screw up a 5 minute talk.