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How it feels to learn JavaScript in 2016

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Re: How it feels to learn JavaScript in 2016

#31

It's easy to show how complex those systems are. It's easy because they are complex. And that's pretty normal. Let someone talk about Java Enterprise development, the symptoms of your body and their diagnoses or just try to explain how to build a pencil ( https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/I,_Pencil ). We're professionals, after all, and TypeScript and React were not build by some teenage hackers. I think the problem is…

Exactly.

When I read those comments on HN, I'm really curious to know how people think you can build, scale and maintain a web app like Facebook. Do they think you can achieve it like in 2006, with a single scrip.js containing 100 000 lines of jQuery soup?

jQuery is fine for any web site or small web apps, but as soon as you reach the 2000 LOC, it's crazy to continue with it.

Re: How it feels to learn JavaScript in 2016

#32

It's easy to show how complex those systems are. It's easy because they are complex. And that's pretty normal. Let someone talk about Java Enterprise development, the symptoms of your body and their diagnoses or just try to explain how to build a pencil ( https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/I,_Pencil ). We're professionals, after all, and TypeScript and React were not build by some teenage hackers. I think the problem is…

> We're professionals, after all, and TypeScript and React were not build by some teenage hackers. Overall correct > The reason is that we started to build complex applications instead of enhancing grandma's blog using jQuery.animate, get over it. And this is where we disagree Complexity is needed sometimes, needless complexity only brings the overall value down If I want to do a website using Django I need to get: D…

and that's how you can use express.js to run a service that uses a different protocol to HTTP.

Express is one of the easiest libraries to learn in any programming language. It's certainly much easier to learn than Django, at least in part because it doesn't include the kitchen sink

Re: How it feels to learn JavaScript in 2016

#34

I know it's super fashionable to hate on javascript, but I'd be very interested to see a similar rant on another area of software. I'm pretty convinced this is just how the industry works.

The same kind of rant applies to things like automake, but only Javascript has this incredibly high rate of churn. Possibly it's easier to build a new toolchain than to understand someone's existing one.

Re: How it feels to learn JavaScript in 2016

#36

It's easy to show how complex those systems are. It's easy because they are complex. And that's pretty normal. Let someone talk about Java Enterprise development, the symptoms of your body and their diagnoses or just try to explain how to build a pencil ( https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/I,_Pencil ). We're professionals, after all, and TypeScript and React were not build by some teenage hackers. I think the problem is…

You don't need complex tools to build complex systems.

The rapid pace of change in the javascript world is what he's poking fun at.

Re: How it feels to learn JavaScript in 2016

#39
post #7

The worst is, if you don't keep up with this, good luck getting a web job five years from now, you'll be the equivalent of a Cobol programmer. Can't get off the train.

Surely you can learn enough about this stuff in 4 weeks of full-time unemployment to pass an interview.

Re: How it feels to learn JavaScript in 2016

#40
I feel like knowing which tools are useful, which ones are currently dominating, and which ones are going to continue being supported in the future is the best place to start learning JavaScript. This is difficult because the ecosystem is so wildly fragmented and insane. You'll get a lot of different opinions if you go searching for them, so here are mine.

ES2015 is the place to start, it is a finished stable release of the latest version of JavaScript. It represents the single largest update to the language in a long time and includes many features that make development easier. It is being phased into web browsers natively and is the future of the language.

For maximum browser support you need a transpiler, this would be a matter of preference because it isn't for you, it's for the computer. TypeScript however is a very very clean transpiler and it offers optional features which are for you, should you choose to use them.

Once you have that setup, you really don't need anything else. You don't need jQuery unless you're trying to support IE8, which is a tiny proportion of the browser market and that will gum up your code significantly.

Speaking of gumming up your code, nearly every single library out there is bloat and can or should be avoided. React is very popular but it suits one very specific use case, it should be used almost nowhere else. Particularly since it is still new and evolving, it is going to cause more headaches than it will resolve. Webpack is an enormous bloated nightmare for example, it messes with even static html for little or no perceivable benefit and honestly just avoid all of it if you're trying to learn JavaScript.

If you want the full-stack experience, Node.js is rapidly becoming the largest JavaScript community on the net. You'll have your questions answered quickly and there are modules for everything you want to do. Choose a markup tool for html and css, such as pug and less.

There you go. State of the art front end JavaScript with two tools. Full stack with five. If it wasn't for the whirlwind massive chaos of the JavaScript community currently, fewer new developers would feel discouraged from becoming involved.

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