Chrome DevTools in 2016 and Beyond • Hacker News Board

Re: Chrome DevTools in 2016 and Beyond

#31

Post by dzhiurgis » Sat, Jun 11, 2016, 2:41 AM UTC

pfooti wrote: post #29

chris_wot wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What, specifically, do you consider inferior about Safari? I'm genuinely curious - I use Chrome, Firefox and Safari regularly and I find Chrome and Safari to be of equal quality. And I notice bugs in Chrome every now and then, but with both browsers I find it pretty rare these days.

Well, as a for-example, safari's support for indexeddb, service workers, push notifications, and just about everything that makes progressive web apps interesting is pretty lacking. As another for-example, I was able to hard-crash safari on ios by setting some CSS attributes on the scroll track about eight months ago - like literally a web page with css that altered how wide the scroll bar track was could CTD safari…

My view is that Safari is leading in privacy and lags in everything else. Meanwhile Chrome absolutely leads in security while Firefox leads in standard support.

I use Chrome for work and Safari for casual browsing. Safari definitely has better tab management (tab expose). I am also sad that Firefox UI looks stale. Their settings & options window look like it hasn't changed since initial release.

Re: Chrome DevTools in 2016 and Beyond

#32

Post by ChrisLTD » Sat, Jun 11, 2016, 3:24 AM UTC

jshevek wrote: post #26

chris_wot wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Whilst the issue may not be the fault of the web designers, there's not really any need to call Safari inferior. It's probably a bug, all browsers have them. My main issue, FWIW, is not that Apple don't fix bugs - it's the long timeframes they take between releases!

Rarely is any description 'needed', but in this case it is 'helpful'. The parent seems to be unaware that Safari has, over time, become inferior (relative to the other popular browsers) increasing the likelihood that the problem is with safari rather than with the site. Being unaware of the inferiority of safari, he didn't even try another browser. Simply knowing that its a safari bug may not be sufficient to maximiz…

In any event, Safari is perfectly capable of scrolling a page.

Re: Chrome DevTools in 2016 and Beyond

#33

Post by kylec » Sat, Jun 11, 2016, 3:31 AM UTC

jshevek wrote: post #26

chris_wot wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Whilst the issue may not be the fault of the web designers, there's not really any need to call Safari inferior. It's probably a bug, all browsers have them. My main issue, FWIW, is not that Apple don't fix bugs - it's the long timeframes they take between releases!

Rarely is any description 'needed', but in this case it is 'helpful'. The parent seems to be unaware that Safari has, over time, become inferior (relative to the other popular browsers) increasing the likelihood that the problem is with safari rather than with the site. Being unaware of the inferiority of safari, he didn't even try another browser. Simply knowing that its a safari bug may not be sufficient to maximiz…

You certainly have made a lot of assumptions about me. I did test in other browsers - Chrome, obviously, and Firefox. But the fact that it works in Chrome and Firefox doesn't excuse the fact that it doesn't work in Safari. I'm a web developer, so it's my job to make things work correctly in all the browsers, Safari included, so from my perspective the creator of the page did a bad job.

Worse, it wasn't something fancy that it's understandable isn't supported in older browsers - it was scrolling, something that literally every web browser ever has been able to do.

Finally, as a web developer and as someone that has used Safari as his primary browser for many years, I rarely have an issue with Safari being "buggy and inferior". You may not get cool new APIs first, but Safari is usually pretty solid and bug-free with the ones it does support.

Re: Chrome DevTools in 2016 and Beyond

#34

Post by pmoleri » Sat, Jun 11, 2016, 4:36 AM UTC

purplerabbit wrote: post #3

Very happy about debugging Node.js in DevTools. Hard to imagine any third-party debugging applications having that amount of features and polish...

If you run your node code from electron you already have access to DevTools. It's really useful.

Re: Chrome DevTools in 2016 and Beyond

#35

Post by ooOOoo » Sat, Jun 11, 2016, 5:02 AM UTC

lucb1e wrote: post #6

They mention "Progressive web apps" and link to some info, but I can't figure out what the difference is from a normal webpage. Do they mean "web apps that use some stuff that was recently added to most modern web browsers"?

The definition of "Progressive Web Apps" according to Google is on https://developers.google.com/web/progressive-web-apps/ and https://codelabs.developers.google.com/codelabs/your-first-p...:

"A Progressive Web Apps is:

* Progressive - Works for every user, regardless of browser choice because it's built with progressive enhancement as a core tenet.

* Responsive - Fits any form factor: desktop, mobile, tablet, or whatever is next.

* Connectivity independent - Enhanced with service workers to work offline or on low-quality networks.

* App-like - Feels like an app to the user with app-style interactions and navigation because it's built on the app shell model.

* Fresh - Always up-to-date thanks to the service worker update process.

* Safe - Served via HTTPS to prevent snooping and to ensure content hasn't been tampered with.

* Discoverable - Is identifiable as an "application" thanks to W3C manifest and service worker registration scope, allowing search engines to find it.

* Re-engageable - Makes re-engagement easy through features like push notifications.

* Installable - Allows users to "keep" apps they find most useful on their home screen without the hassle of an app store.

* Linkable - Easily share via URL, does not require complex installation."

Re: Chrome DevTools in 2016 and Beyond

#36

Post by mateuszf » Sat, Jun 11, 2016, 5:37 AM UTC

chris_wot wrote: post #23

Is there a way of doing a long running log of all network, page load speeds, etc. in Chrome and store it in a reasonably efficient format? Like a perfmon/tracer for the browser. I ask this because I've been trying to track down an issue - probably caused by an ad on a news website - where Chrone pretty much freezes up on all processes. Whilst I can (and have) worked around it by installing uBlock Origin in browsers I…

I'm not sure if this would be of any help, but maybe - so check it out:

https://github.com/kdzwinel/betwixt

Re: Chrome DevTools in 2016 and Beyond

#37

Post by billions » Sat, Jun 11, 2016, 6:45 AM UTC

After 5+ years of developing in Chrome Dev tools, I switched to Safari 2 weeks ago (Mac) and couldn't be happier. Chrome has become bloated. Ever notice CPU fans ramping up? Only while Dev Tools is open. Memory hog is an understatement. Furthermore, while Chrome's light, prebundled Flash was an asset 3 years ago it's now a liability: most websites now gracefully fallback to HTML5 video. Safari's upcoming leading edge standard support announcement makes it a candidate for best dev browser. (Hint: try Safari's Responsive Mode)

Re: Chrome DevTools in 2016 and Beyond

#38

Post by TD-Linux » Sat, Jun 11, 2016, 6:49 AM UTC

dzhiurgis wrote: post #31

pfooti wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, as a for-example, safari's support for indexeddb, service workers, push notifications, and just about everything that makes progressive web apps interesting is pretty lacking. As another for-example, I was able to hard-crash safari on ios by setting some CSS attributes on the scroll track about eight months ago - like literally a web page with css that altered how wide the scroll bar track was could CTD safari…

My view is that Safari is leading in privacy and lags in everything else. Meanwhile Chrome absolutely leads in security while Firefox leads in standard support. I use Chrome for work and Safari for casual browsing. Safari definitely has better tab management (tab expose). I am also sad that Firefox UI looks stale. Their settings & options window look like it hasn't changed since initial release.

The settings window changed - it is now a full screen tab.

Re: Chrome DevTools in 2016 and Beyond

#39

Post by [deleted] » Sat, Jun 11, 2016, 6:53 AM UTC

billions wrote: post #37

After 5+ years of developing in Chrome Dev tools, I switched to Safari 2 weeks ago (Mac) and couldn't be happier. Chrome has become bloated. Ever notice CPU fans ramping up? Only while Dev Tools is open. Memory hog is an understatement. Furthermore, while Chrome's light, prebundled Flash was an asset 3 years ago it's now a liability: most websites now gracefully fallback to HTML5 video. Safari's upcoming leading edge…

[deleted]

Re: Chrome DevTools in 2016 and Beyond

#40

Post by z3t4 » Sat, Jun 11, 2016, 6:59 AM UTC

NodeJS and Chromium have complete different debugging API's. It would be cool if they where the same, so you could reuse the debugging tools on both platforms.