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Norway reportedly agrees on banning new sales of gas-powered cars by 2025

electrek.co

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Re: Norway reportedly agrees on banning new sales of gas-powered cars by 2025

#31

Post by larsiusprime »

oldmanjay wrote: post #21
wrong_variable wrote: post #5

To anyone who is thinking: 1) Yeah, they are a small resource rich country, not practical for the rest of us. America, Canada, UK, Saudi Arabia and Australia were resource rich and still are ( America is the largest producer of oil ) and had the opportunity to do what Norway did but chose not to do it. UK had a huge surplus from north sea oil during the 1990s which is allowed private companies to profit off. Same wit…

Norway is culturally optimized for safe equilibrium. America is culturally optimized for risky advancement. It's pretty starkly different and makes direct single-variable comparisons into shallow exercises in meaninglessness

Norway is also tiny and SOVEREIGN. Any similarly inclined USA state must answer to the other 49.

Re: Norway reportedly agrees on banning new sales of gas-powered cars by 2025

#32

Post by vpeters25 »

moonfern wrote: post #6

It's not that petrol cars will be forbidden but buying a new non zero emission car in 2025 will be financially not beneficial, according to Norwegian press. 99% of the electricity in Norway comes from hydro power plants, it's a huge exporter of gas and oil and it's rich. That makes it easier to make such a progressive decision but congrats for setting the first deadline.

This sounds like a more balanced approach than the linked article which claims an outright ban on oil-based vehicles.

I think banning any technology is a bad idea. Imho, the problem with climate change is not the burning of oil or carbon, but the emissions from doing it.

Re: Norway reportedly agrees on banning new sales of gas-powered cars by 2025

#33

Post by digi_owl »

cm3 wrote: post #16
wrong_variable wrote: post #5

To anyone who is thinking: 1) Yeah, they are a small resource rich country, not practical for the rest of us. America, Canada, UK, Saudi Arabia and Australia were resource rich and still are ( America is the largest producer of oil ) and had the opportunity to do what Norway did but chose not to do it. UK had a huge surplus from north sea oil during the 1990s which is allowed private companies to profit off. Same wit…

It's a matter of different politics. Norway chose not to basically let private companies take all the profit from natural resources, while in the UK there's this weird system in place that has politicians ruining public orgs like infrastructure providers to afterwards claim they fixed it, once they pushed for privatization, and all they did was get it back to where it was before in quality of service. After that, it'…

Norway is turning UK year by year...

Re: Norway reportedly agrees on banning new sales of gas-powered cars by 2025

#34

Post by adamnemecek »

fleitz wrote: post #26
oldmanjay wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Norway is culturally optimized for safe equilibrium. America is culturally optimized for risky advancement. It's pretty starkly different and makes direct single-variable comparisons into shallow exercises in meaninglessness

It's also much less diverse than America.

How's that relevant?

Re: Norway reportedly agrees on banning new sales of gas-powered cars by 2025

#37

Post by digi_owl »

moonfern wrote: post #6

It's not that petrol cars will be forbidden but buying a new non zero emission car in 2025 will be financially not beneficial, according to Norwegian press. 99% of the electricity in Norway comes from hydro power plants, it's a huge exporter of gas and oil and it's rich. That makes it easier to make such a progressive decision but congrats for setting the first deadline.

Their problem is that once more they can't think beyond the capitol. There already are all kinds of silly taxes and such to try to get people to drive less etc.

But outside of the biggest cities public transport only runs during office hours. End result is that owning and using a car i vital to continued survival.

So expect this to turn petrol cars into something of a Giffen good, if not an outright Veblen good.

Re: Norway reportedly agrees on banning new sales of gas-powered cars by 2025

#38

Post by dogma1138 »

geon wrote: post #12
moonfern wrote: post #6

It's not that petrol cars will be forbidden but buying a new non zero emission car in 2025 will be financially not beneficial, according to Norwegian press. 99% of the electricity in Norway comes from hydro power plants, it's a huge exporter of gas and oil and it's rich. That makes it easier to make such a progressive decision but congrats for setting the first deadline.

The US should do it too, if only for ending it's dependency on imported oil.

The US is a net exporter of Oil, but like with many other products it imports as almost much as it exports.

Just be aware that the US imports 40% of it's Oil from Canada if it stops doing so it will have a major impact on Canada's economy which is a thing no one wants especially considering the current issues with the Canadian economy. However it if wanted too it could stop importing oil all together today since it has more than enough local production, it would however increase the cost of gas and other petroproducts in the US since the US often imports considerably cheaper oil from OPEC and Canada while exporting fairly expensive US crude.

Re: Norway reportedly agrees on banning new sales of gas-powered cars by 2025

#39

Post by jpollock »

wrong_variable wrote: post #5

To anyone who is thinking: 1) Yeah, they are a small resource rich country, not practical for the rest of us. America, Canada, UK, Saudi Arabia and Australia were resource rich and still are ( America is the largest producer of oil ) and had the opportunity to do what Norway did but chose not to do it. UK had a huge surplus from north sea oil during the 1990s which is allowed private companies to profit off. Same wit…

All of the countries mentioned have royalty regimes which companies have to pay to extract natural resources. Oil extraction in Texas has a 25% royalty rate [2]. This is typically based off of the retail price, not some interim price too.

Governments are very careful to set royalty rates appropriately. Extraction companies compare total costs, so countries with low labour and shipping costs can have higher royalties than countries with high costs. [3] I've seen a report out of New Zealand showing just how mercenary this is, comparing the cost-to-market from several countries complete with royalty rate comparisons.

The difference is in what the countries do with the royalties. For example, Alberta does have a sovereign wealth fund, but it also doesn't collect sales tax. Saudi Arabia has a huge sovereign fund - just not quite as big as Norway's. Saudi Arabia also has no personal income taxes.

Norway's genius is in sending the royalties through the fund, and then only allowing them to spend at most 4% of the total [1] - the estimated average annual return.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Government_Pension_Fund_of_Nor...

[2] https://www.americanprogress.org/issues/green/report/2015/06...

[3] http://money.cnn.com/interactive/economy/the-cost-to-produce...

Re: Norway reportedly agrees on banning new sales of gas-powered cars by 2025

#40

Post by digi_owl »

larsiusprime wrote: post #25
hkjgkjy wrote: post #3

Off topic: Anyone watch Okkupert (occupied in English)? The French-Norwegian made drama about how a modern European country would act if war were to happen there today (like it kind of has in Ukraine...). http://www.imdb.com/title/tt4192998/

(Norwegian here). Great show, but it's so hilariously and transparently self-flattering to the Norwegian sense of self. Norway boldly goes zero-emission and turns off the fossil fuel tap. The European Union essentially hires Russia to swoop in and invade in response to turn the tap back on. When the shocked Norwegian prime minister demands to talk to the person in charge, the EU chief's head pops up and scolds them s…

Yeah the show is pandering to the whole "Putin scare" that MSM has going.
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