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Cupertino's mayor: Apple 'abuses us' by not paying taxes

theguardian.com

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Re: Cupertino's mayor: Apple 'abuses us' by not paying taxes

#31

Post by [deleted] »

dragontamer wrote: post #13
demarq wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>What's his logic for this special Tax on Apple "You’re helping create the problems, so you have to help solve the problem" - Chang

Maybe if he described what these problems were, he's get my support. But considering that he can't even get the support of his own citizens at Town Hall meetings, nor the support of his fellow council members, methinks he's simply incompetent. And that the problems he describes are made up in his imagination. I can't imagine it to be too difficult to come up with a budget that says "We have to pay for X Million Dolla…

[deleted]

Re: Cupertino's mayor: Apple 'abuses us' by not paying taxes

#32

Post by Lazare »

martinald wrote: post #15

In the UK we have the concept of "Section 106" payments which allow a development through planning by the developer paying the local government some amount of money to redress the cost of dealing with congestion, public relam, affordable housing, etc. For large skyscraper developments in London, this can be many many millions of pounds. Does something similar exist in CA?

Yes. But it's usually handled at a higher government level than the local council of a 60k person town. :) California, in particular, is somewhat famous for having an enormous number of state agencies; I rather assume one or more of those made the deal with Apple.

Re: Cupertino's mayor: Apple 'abuses us' by not paying taxes

#33

Post by ptaipale »

justin66 wrote: post #16
sourcd wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As I said, in some countries, you can't treat an on duty public/government "servant" like that.

If he'd been a police officer investigating a crime, or a fire marshall, that wouldn't fly. Doing it to the mayor is just rude.

It depends. If the mayor has been rude or dishonest himself, it isn't. And as someome said, this does not quite pass the smell test.

Re: Cupertino's mayor: Apple 'abuses us' by not paying taxes

#34

Post by golergka »

Lazare wrote: post #27

I can't believe Apple is wilfully not paying property taxes on their headquarters! That's quite illegal, and I'm sure... ...oh, they are paying their property taxes? I see. So which taxes, precisely, are they not paying the Cupertino government? Oh, there aren't any taxes, but you sort of wish someone with the authority to do so would pass a law making new taxes, but they won't, so you're mad at...Apple? 'k.

He isn't trying to make new taxes exactly, he just wants his $100 million. Apple's so big, they shouldn't mind parting with $100 mil for no good reason, right? It's not like they have responsibilities to shareholders or something.

Re: Cupertino's mayor: Apple 'abuses us' by not paying taxes

#35

Post by apeace »

> Apple pays a 2.3% effective tax rate on its $181bn in cash held offshore...

> ...shield themselves off from the theoretically 35% federal corporate tax rate

Something seems wrong here. I don't think companies are expected to pay 35% yearly on cash reserves. Am I confused, or is the article? If anyone is knowledgable about this I'd be interested to know the deal!

Re: Cupertino's mayor: Apple 'abuses us' by not paying taxes

#36

Post by adventured »

dragontamer wrote: post #10

> At a recent Cupertino city council meeting, some residents protested about a lack of funding for public projects, Chang said – even crumpling up meeting agendas and throwing them. “They ball up the paper and throw it, and they say ‘You’re making all the wrong decisions’,” Chang said. “In the meantime Apple is not willing to pay a dime. They’re making profit, and they should share the responsibility for our city, bu…

If Apple is meant to pay a new tax based on their net income, then every business that operates in Cupertino should obviously pay the same tax. Let's see how that goes over.

Re: Cupertino's mayor: Apple 'abuses us' by not paying taxes

#37

Post by adventured »

krisdol wrote: post #19
alfl23 wrote: post #2

Is the money better in the hands of a super overgrown and overstaffed organisation like the US government when most of it goes to paying interest to the lovely central banks folks and the public has almost 0 transparency over its expenditure? The perfect portrayal of profound inefficiency and over-bloated corporate structure. It's fun and easy to point fingers, and while tax avoidance should by no means by encouraged…

Apple has yet to provide me with food stamps or public housing, both of which saved me when I was a refugee. I can check with my spouse but I'm pretty sure the public hospital she works at was not an apple product. The rest is just ridiculous. If you want an effective government, you have to take privatization out of it, not rely on it as we have.

Apple paid $46 billion in just income taxes over the last three fiscal years. The majority of that was likely in the US market, where they're more heavily taxed and have a very large market share.

I don't know where you live, but if it's in the US, then you're wrong: they did in fact help pay for food stamps and public housing.

Last fiscal year, Apple generated $72.5 billion in income before income taxes, and paid $19.1 billion in income taxes ($53.3b in net income). That's a 26.3% rate. That rate is higher than corporations pay in almost any other developed nation (Europe typically has the lowest corporate income tax rates for example), and that's after they go out of their way to try to avoid paying taxes. That $19 billion in taxes pays for a lot of welfare state benefits.

Re: Cupertino's mayor: Apple 'abuses us' by not paying taxes

#38

Post by nihonde »

jefurii wrote: post #23
nihonde wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The idea that Apple isn't the best thing that ever happened to Cupertino, California is hilarious.

No, the idea that the city should have to provide roads, utilities, etc to a huge, rich corporation and get nothing back for their trouble is terrible.

Creating the world's most successful company in your backyard, attracting high-value talent from all over the world, making Cupertino a household name...is "giving nothing back"?

Re: Cupertino's mayor: Apple 'abuses us' by not paying taxes

#39

Post by mdasen »

apeace wrote: post #35

> Apple pays a 2.3% effective tax rate on its $181bn in cash held offshore... > ...shield themselves off from the theoretically 35% federal corporate tax rate Something seems wrong here. I don't think companies are expected to pay 35% yearly on cash reserves. Am I confused, or is the article? If anyone is knowledgable about this I'd be interested to know the deal!

Basically all countries tax companies on income earned in that country. So, if you're a UK company and you earn $1B in the UK and $500M in France, you pay tax on $1B to the UK government and tax on $500M to the French government.

The US taxes companies on their worldwide income when they re-patriate that money to the US. So, if you earned $500M in France and want to bring that money back into the US, you owe US taxes on it (in addition to the French taxes already paid). If you don't bring the money back to the US, you just pay the French taxes.

People have called the ability to hold the money overseas a loophole, but given that basically no other country taxes companies on their worldwide income, it seems more that the US is the outlier.

Let's put it this way. A UK-based firm earns $1B in the US and $1B in the UK and has to pay the American tax authorities on $1B and UK tax authorities on $1B and it can then bring the profit back from the US. That seems fair. By contrast, a US-based firm earns the same amount in each country and must pay the US tax on $1B, the UK tax on $1B, and then the US tax on whatever they bring back from the UK (which has already had UK tax paid on it). This encourages companies to reinvest their profits overseas rather than bring the money back to the US where it would get taxed again.

It's partly because the US is so large and has been more isolated than most countries. Likewise, it's basically the only country that taxes individuals based on citizenship rather than residency.

Re: Cupertino's mayor: Apple 'abuses us' by not paying taxes

#40

Post by afsina »

mdasen wrote: post #18

Absolutely terrible article. In an article about property taxes paid or unpaid, it doesn't even mention property taxes. Is Apple's campus under-assessed? A little Googling shows Cupertino's tax rate as $7.96 on a thousand which would value Apple's campus at $1.16B. Is that a lot? Is that a little? What are other companies assessed at in Cupertino and surrounding cities? The article talks about income taxes which are…

"The Guardian" has a left leaning bias. So I am not surprised with the way of reporting.
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