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Human intelligence is overrated (2012)

togelius.blogspot.com

31–40 of 98 posts

Re: Human intelligence is overrated (2012)

#31
post #18

> But the argument goes both ways here as well: take an arbitrary human (such as yourself, if you happen to be human) and try placing this human in the cockpit of a landing jet plane, in a semiconductor factory, in the oval office of the White House, in the kitchen of a gourmet restaurant, on a horseback in Siberia, or equipped with only a spear in the middle of the Amazonas jungle. There are humans that have been pr…

> Detecting and ignoring spurious inputs and extreme edge cases are one of the main reasons that I feel better if there's a person alert and at the controls of a plane

But what is more likely: a human pilot detecting and resolving problems with the computer systems, or the human accidentally crashing the plane?

Re: Human intelligence is overrated (2012)

#32
post #6

Multiplying 3842 by 543 is very hard for humans. They're slow and inaccurate. Computers do it perfectly at incredible speeds. Inventing multiplication is something no computer (as we currently understand them) would ever be able to do. For another analogy, moving ten tons of rock a thousand feet is something humans can do, and have done for millennia. It's very slow and difficult. A bulldozer can do the same thing in…

The average human couldn't invent multiplication either - it took humanity as a whole thousands of years to get to that point. Even writing was only independently invented a handful of times in history.

Re: Human intelligence is overrated (2012)

#33
post #29
post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's partly because nobody has tried very hard to write one piece of software that's good at landing planes and being the president. Why not just write two pieces of software? What business model would a combined piece of software enable? Specialization of software is mostly a virtue.

Isn't it somewhat the same with humans though?

Yes. Because a specialized pilot or president will always be better than a generalist at that particular task.

Part of the argument given for the virtues of generalization is about availability. Like, if you find yourself the only available person in a plane over the Amazon, you can improvise a landing. But as the network connects more things in more places, this becomes less and less important.

Re: Human intelligence is overrated (2012)

#34
post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Small nit, but as hinted at by the other responses, humans didn't "invent" multiplication, they discovered it. In the same way we didn't "invent" the fact that the earth revolves around the sun, we discovered it.

I'd argue that we discovered the earth goes around the sun, but we invented multiplication. It's a philosophical argument, however.

Generally invention applies to the first discovers. I would suggest in the entire universe both observable or not we are unlikely to be the first species to discover multiplication. Languages like English, French etc on the other hand have much better odds even if language as a concept is really old.

PS: I have even seen 'rediscovery' used for the same situations when a math idea was lost etc.

Re: Human intelligence is overrated (2012)

#35
post #2

It is an existential horror SciFi novel, but BlindSight by Peter Watts is the only book I've seen talk about this idea. Avoiding totally spoiling the book, it asks the question: "Is consciousness really a survival trait in the long term?"

I'd suggest you edit the second sentence, as that is a huge spoiler.

Re: Human intelligence is overrated (2012)

#36
post #6

Multiplying 3842 by 543 is very hard for humans. They're slow and inaccurate. Computers do it perfectly at incredible speeds. Inventing multiplication is something no computer (as we currently understand them) would ever be able to do. For another analogy, moving ten tons of rock a thousand feet is something humans can do, and have done for millennia. It's very slow and difficult. A bulldozer can do the same thing in…

> Inventing multiplication is something no computer (as we currently understand them) would ever be able to do. AM, the discovery learning program developed by Doug Lenat, discovered multiplication, beginning with a few basic facts about set theory, and using about 200 heuristics.

I don't consider this an example of discovering multiplication. The set theory rules were given to the computer. Can a computer be built to start only with sensory input and then discover the rules of set theory? Would it ever be able recognize why the patterns and rules for operating with sets are important and worth further study? I'm skeptical.

Would a program flag the discovery of multiplication as important because it understood that this discovery is interesting or would it flag its discovery as important because the programmer encoded it to have this understanding? That is can a program discover something new and alert to humans to this discovery and for it to be truly interesting and new?

Re: Human intelligence is overrated (2012)

#37
post #6

Multiplying 3842 by 543 is very hard for humans. They're slow and inaccurate. Computers do it perfectly at incredible speeds. Inventing multiplication is something no computer (as we currently understand them) would ever be able to do. For another analogy, moving ten tons of rock a thousand feet is something humans can do, and have done for millennia. It's very slow and difficult. A bulldozer can do the same thing in…

Small nit, but as hinted at by the other responses, humans didn't "invent" multiplication, they discovered it. In the same way we didn't "invent" the fact that the earth revolves around the sun, we discovered it.

that's debatable, once you appreciate the point about having a reason to do something.

calculation itself really only exists with purpose. it's a thing to do if you have a reason to do it. of course, these kinds of things too seem more "discovered" than "invented", but it's a very different kind of discovery than "the earth revolves around the sun". the earth revolves around the son, as far as we can figure these days, whether any agent/subjectivity/etc intends anything or not.

however, no full-blooded calculation will ever occur anywhere in the universe unless someone needs to figure something out. in other words, intention is implicit with calculation (and truth-functional representation, by the by). as such, you could make a case for an argument for "inventing" strategies in mathematics. and of course, a lot depends on your ontology of mathematics in the first place. if you're a wittgensteinian about numbers, and you think any of what i said above is at all compelling, you may be inclined to believe that mathematics itself is an invention. you may admit of some more nuanced way that entities like "number" still exist without mathematics as a tool, you may not, but you'd probably see all mathematics existing as active work, not pre-existing objective Truth.

of course, most people think of math as an always-there abstract object (roughly). maybe they're right. even so, there must be some force in the "i use it as a tool" and "it just revolves around the sun no matter what anyone--god or man or beast--wants" distinction.

Re: Human intelligence is overrated (2012)

#38

> It would be very easy to invent games that were so complicated that only computers could play them; computers could even invent such games automatically. Of the many errors in this article this is one of the most flagrant. Computers have yet to invent any novel and challenging games. That would take ingenuity, something computers have failed to demonstrate. However, I suspect the author is trolling a bit.

Every time you play a video game that uses generated levels, you are playing a game "invented" by a computer.

Re: Human intelligence is overrated (2012)

#39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Doug Lenat's Automated Mathematician (AM) apparently did "discover" multiplication by itself: http://web.onetel.net.uk/~hibou/ai-course/lenat.txt https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automated_Mathematician Of course, you could argue that multiplication was implicitly there in the rules and facts it was programmed with.

Let me know when humans invent something not governed by the rules the universe was programmed with ;-)

Theoretical physicists do that every day. It's only noteworthy when they find one that actually corresponds to the real world...

Re: Human intelligence is overrated (2012)

#40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Inventing multiplication is something no computer (as we currently understand them) would ever be able to do. AM, the discovery learning program developed by Doug Lenat, discovered multiplication, beginning with a few basic facts about set theory, and using about 200 heuristics.

I don't consider this an example of discovering multiplication. The set theory rules were given to the computer. Can a computer be built to start only with sensory input and then discover the rules of set theory? Would it ever be able recognize why the patterns and rules for operating with sets are important and worth further study? I'm skeptical. Would a program flag the discovery of multiplication as important beca…

Absolutely. Look at Pat Langley's BACON program back in the 80's. He didn't work on multiplication per se, but given nothing but "sensory input" it discovered laws of planetary motion, rules of physical chemistry, conservation laws, etc.
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