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San Francisco Tech Firms See Workers Flee from $4,500 Rents

bloomberg.com

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Re: San Francisco Tech Firms See Workers Flee from $4,500 Rents

#31

Post by sliverstorm »

dkopi wrote: post #21
simook wrote: post #2

Portland resident here. What this article doesn't cover, is now locals are victim of gentrification. Rent prices are almost 2x, out of state buyers are throwing all cash offers on houses, and overall housing supply is low... I'm sure the commercial market is just as bad. Interesting times.

It's 2016, and people still think that if someone moves into your neighborhood, someone else has to move out. Rising demand is great. It means people want to enjoy your neighborhood. You can either meet that demand by increasing supply, or you can restrict the demand, and let certain people be outpriced by the market. Locals aren't victims of gentrification. They're victims of zoning laws and nimbyism.

So consider a nice, quaint neighborhood. Person A lives there. Person B wants to live there too, because it is so nice.

Ok, let's say we double supply.

All the houses are now either twice as high, or half as big, or maybe the trees were cut down and the bushes ripped out to make room. There's twice as many people & everything therein. Is it still the same nice neighborhood?

Re: San Francisco Tech Firms See Workers Flee from $4,500 Rents

#32

Post by talmand »

leesalminen wrote: post #14
cmurf wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same in Denver. Realtor told me 1/4 of properties don't make the MLS, they're bought with cash before they can get listed.

Boulder as well. A buddy of mine had a hell of a time getting a condo with a mortgage. They were all bought up in cash within a day or 2.

Somebody's busy setting up another housing bubble.

Re: San Francisco Tech Firms See Workers Flee from $4,500 Rents

#33

Post by cehrnrooth »

Apocryphon wrote: post #9

"They’ve increased 38 percent in Seattle, 12 percent in Austin and 6 percent in Phoenix." The article names the usual suspects for engineer emigrants (Austin, Portland, strangely no mention of NYC or Raleigh RTP), but why are people moving to Phoenix? Isn't living in the less sexy areas of South Bay (Sunnyvale, Milpitas, South San Jose) pretty much on par with urban life in Phoenix?

Quality of life is probably similar but the cost of living is much lower.

Re: San Francisco Tech Firms See Workers Flee from $4,500 Rents

#34

Post by jgmmo »

simook wrote: post #2

Portland resident here. What this article doesn't cover, is now locals are victim of gentrification. Rent prices are almost 2x, out of state buyers are throwing all cash offers on houses, and overall housing supply is low... I'm sure the commercial market is just as bad. Interesting times.

Dear folks interested in Oregon, come to Eugene!

Re: San Francisco Tech Firms See Workers Flee from $4,500 Rents

#35

Post by davidw »

sliverstorm wrote: post #31
dkopi wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's 2016, and people still think that if someone moves into your neighborhood, someone else has to move out. Rising demand is great. It means people want to enjoy your neighborhood. You can either meet that demand by increasing supply, or you can restrict the demand, and let certain people be outpriced by the market. Locals aren't victims of gentrification. They're victims of zoning laws and nimbyism.

So consider a nice, quaint neighborhood. Person A lives there. Person B wants to live there too, because it is so nice. Ok, let's say we double supply. All the houses are now either twice as high, or half as big, or maybe the trees were cut down and the bushes ripped out to make room. There's twice as many people & everything therein. Is it still the same nice neighborhood?

Was it the same neighborhood when you moved there?

Things change, especially in the US.

"The immaculate conception theory of your neighborhood’s origins": http://cityobservatory.org/the-immaculate-conception-theory-...

And: if prices are going up that much, and you really want out, you can sell and move, to, say, Lakeview, Oregon.

Re: San Francisco Tech Firms See Workers Flee from $4,500 Rents

#36

Post by Laaw »

talmand wrote: post #32
leesalminen wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Boulder as well. A buddy of mine had a hell of a time getting a condo with a mortgage. They were all bought up in cash within a day or 2.

Somebody's busy setting up another housing bubble.

With cash? Dunno about that...

Re: San Francisco Tech Firms See Workers Flee from $4,500 Rents

#37

Post by davidw »

jgmmo wrote: post #34
simook wrote: post #2

Portland resident here. What this article doesn't cover, is now locals are victim of gentrification. Rent prices are almost 2x, out of state buyers are throwing all cash offers on houses, and overall housing supply is low... I'm sure the commercial market is just as bad. Interesting times.

Dear folks interested in Oregon, come to Eugene!

Grew up there. Still seems like it's struggling to put together much of a tech industry. More seems to be happening here in Bend in some ways, despite being a significantly smaller town. And the weather is way better over here too!

Re: San Francisco Tech Firms See Workers Flee from $4,500 Rents

#38

Post by sliverstorm »

davidw wrote: post #35
sliverstorm wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So consider a nice, quaint neighborhood. Person A lives there. Person B wants to live there too, because it is so nice. Ok, let's say we double supply. All the houses are now either twice as high, or half as big, or maybe the trees were cut down and the bushes ripped out to make room. There's twice as many people & everything therein. Is it still the same nice neighborhood?

Was it the same neighborhood when you moved there? Things change, especially in the US. "The immaculate conception theory of your neighborhood’s origins": http://cityobservatory.org/the-immaculate-conception-theory-... And: if prices are going up that much, and you really want out, you can sell and move, to, say, Lakeview, Oregon.

Yes, things change. But I contest the notion that adding more housing to a neighborhood is a magic bullet that will make everyone happy.

Among many issues, the fundamental attractiveness of a particular neighborhood may be tied to low population density.

In which case ripping down the neighborhood and rebuilding makes neither resident Person A nor prospective buyer Person B happy.

Re: San Francisco Tech Firms See Workers Flee from $4,500 Rents

#39

Post by api »

Apocryphon wrote: post #27
api wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It seems to be full of people who want to be near art and "cool" people. Unfortunately tech doesn't find a way to pay those creators of culture anything. If anything, the focus is on finding ways to make everything free. So tech moves in, enjoys the presence of creative culture they refuse to fund, but ultimately inflates real estate so much they drive that creative culture away. Rinse and repeat. If art and culture…

I'm not sure if a lot of the hip tech transplants want art. They just want the aesthetics.

I think what they want is culture, which is produced by people who love their communities and who don't work 90 hours a week so they have time to actually do it.
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